Talk:History of computer hardware in Eastern Bloc countries

Just partial info

Untitled

A lot of info is missing. Just one example: first, most popular Polish PC is missing(sic). http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meritum_%28komputer%29 Unless this is completely rewritten article - please label it as Article that contains only partial information. As for now grammar is the least of a problem here. Piotr — Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.203.211.148 (talk) 14:19, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

Where are Chinese & North-Korean computers?

I can't believe they have none, especially knowing their quite successful space programs. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.90.165.14 (talk) 11:58, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

This article is about computers in Soviet bloc countries; in other words, countries within the USSR. China and North Korea have never been in the USSR. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.223.130.32 (talk) 21:56, 25 October 2016 (UTC)

Sources

Some sources for Polish section:

• (en) http://www.ipipan.waw.pl/~lat50/annals.htm
• (en) http://www.thocp.net/timeline/pl.htm
• (pl) http://www.republika.pl/historiakomputerow/dane/jkpwp.htm
• (pl) http://www.mimuw.edu.pl/informacje/varia/hist-inf.html?PHPSESSID=c38d5203f4ab2ff722d63e6ede33549d

Matusz

German section:

• (de) http://www.computer-archiv.de/comp0049.htm#R%20100
• (de) http://robotron.informatik.hu-berlin.de/
• (de) http://www.robotron-net.de/
• (de) http://www.mobiltom.de/z1013.html
• (de) http://www.robotrontechnik.de/

Phrasing in the title

The Soviet bloc? How about Eastern Europe, Warsaw Pact or something? Zocky 22:34, 11 Dec 2003 (UTC)

Pochemu nyet? There is an Eastern Europe redirect, BTW.

Charles Matthews 22:40, 11 Dec 2003 (UTC)

I moved it to Eastern Europe and someone move dit back, hence the redirect. Secretlondon 22:56, Dec 11, 2003 (UTC)

1. I don't know if the name is proper, please remember to rename links if you move the article.
2. I haven't done much search or research into this subject, please forgive me if the info is biased or incorrect.

Matusz 22:30, 11 Dec 2003 (UTC)

"Eastern Europe" is just geographical, though. This article specifically concerns a time period as well as a place. "Warsaw Pact" omits Yugoslavia, which may or may not matter here. Salsa Shark 22:47, 11 Dec 2003 (UTC)

Yes, but Soviet bloc is, at best, a former informal name for countries of the Warsaw Pact. It's like calling the article History of computing behind the iron curtain. Eastern Europe, IMO, say enough, and including Yugoslavia here would be very appropriate. We had many of the same problems. Zocky 22:50, 11 Dec 2003 (UTC)

How about other communist countries like China and Cuba? they surely are not in Europe. Will they get their own articles on the subject? Matusz 22:53, 11 Dec 2003 (UTC)

I suppose it all depends on whether you want to focus on the region or the political environment. If the latter, I do admit 'Soviet bloc' sounds a bit cold-warrish to me, and 'communist Europe' or 'communist countries' might work better. Salsa Shark 23:06, 11 Dec 2003 (UTC)

I prefer communist countries. Secretlondon 23:07, Dec 11, 2003 (UTC)

Make it communist countries then, just rename all links also. Matusz 23:20, 11 Dec 2003 (UTC)

I moved it and fixed the links. Secretlondon 16:32, Dec 15, 2003 (UTC)

It is fairly clearly a Cold War story, though, given the export restrictions imposed at the time. Charles Matthews 15:50, 15 Dec 2003 (UTC)

I don't think communist states, is a right name, exUSSR and it's allies were officialy recognized as socialist states.

Title and content

Well, I am only two years late for this thread, but nevertheless..."Communist countries" here does indeed seem to talk about the USSR and allies otherwise members of Comecon and/or Warsaw Pact. However, Yugoslavia was a communist country that was not a member of either nor was a USSR ally, but it had some very interesting development of its own. I don't know the entire history myself, but many systems existed - Galaksija, CER (photo), Iskra Delta Partner and 800, Orao, Pecom 32/64, Lola 8, Galeb 101, Tim 011 and probably more.

Is it that the name of the article isn't correct as it does not account for China, Cuba, etc. or that it deals with just Comecon? Maybe we should rename and expand the article or make it an introduction and break away pieces into sub-articles?

--Aleksandar Šušnjar 15:53, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

Anybody here interested in helping solve this issue? Here are the things that need to be fixed (some exclude others):

1. Article can be renamed to reflect its content (must be careful to include all relevant countries):
   1. "History of computer hardware in USSR" (implies only one country)
   2. "History of computer hardware in Warsaw Pact countries" (implies military)
   3. "History of computer hardware in Comecon countries" (implies trade agreement, possibly too many countries)
   4. "History of computer hardware in Soviet Bloc countries" (probably the best, my favourite)
   5. Something else - please suggest.
2. If article is renamed, a new article of current name is created not as a redirect but as a starting point to all relevant sub-articles.
3. Article is not renamed but content is updated:
   1. Introduction must be essentially rewritten. Sentence "Since Communist party propaganda maintained..." needs to be changed to state that such thing did not appear in all Communist countries (e.g. SFRY). Where was this applicable? Same thing applies to the following sentence - metric inches. SFRY did have its own computers but also legally imported those from the West. On the other hand, SFRY did have strict import limitation laws.
   2. A section on SFRY can then be added. A number of articles already exist: CER-10, CER-20, Galaksija, but there are more to be added. See my planned articles.
   3. Perhaps the article can then be further structured, i.e. to separate Soviet block from the other countries, etc. if need arises.

Please comment. If noone oposes I will proceed to rename this article and do related changes as per above.

--Aleksandar Šušnjar 21:44, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

Noone seemed interested ... renamed the article from "History of computer hardware in communist countries" to "History of computer hardware in Soviet Bloc countries", adjusted the content slightly and, re-linked links that really relate directly to this article.

--Aleksandar Šušnjar 17:31, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

Overview missing

I think we need someone who has an overview. I've added a little about Robotron, but I've no idea how to verify if the Polish ones were the first, or not. I suspect POV but it may be true. Secretlondon 22:56, Dec 11, 2003 (UTC)

Internet says that Odra 1203 was built in 1963 and manufacturing started in 1964. I was not able to track any Robotron computers earlier than 1977. Maybe deeper search is needed. Matusz 23:18, 11 Dec 2003 (UTC)

I've found one - an R 100 (1963) from [1] Secretlondon 23:26, Dec 11, 2003 (UTC)

same page: PRL - 1960, same year Odra 1001 was designed. Matusz 23:39, 11 Dec 2003 (UTC)

We should probably check to see if they were different computers - and not just badged differently. Secretlondon 23:42, Dec 11, 2003 (UTC)

OPREMA computer produced by Carl Zeiss Jena VEB in 1954. ZRA 1 (also from Carl Zeiss Jena) 1956. 1963 R100 (Robotron) From [[2]. This source claims that the GDR's first computer was the OPREMA. Secretlondon 15:42, Dec 15, 2003 (UTC)

Poland

Odra — Preceding unsigned comment added by Secretlondon (talk • contribs) Dec 15, 2003

Don't forget the R32. HughesJohn (talk) 10:24, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

GDR

Robotron R100 1963 Carl Zeiss Jena 1954 OPREMA, ZRA1 1956 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Secretlondon (talk • contribs) Dec 15, 2003

Hungary

Videoton - 1970 production working with Bull and DataProducts — Preceding unsigned comment added by Secretlondon (talk • contribs) Dec 15, 2003

Here is a page about Videoton computers: http://retropages.uw.hu/Videoton.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.183.183.150 (talk) 21:47, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

USSR

I first read about Strela in IEEE Spectrum in the 1970s. Ancheta Wis 06:04, 8 May 2004 (UTC)

Metric Inch

What is a metric inch??? Inches aren't metric! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.94.167.145 (talk • contribs) 26 June 2007

"Metric inch" is a name given to a measure unit equivalent to 2.5 cm, instead of the 2.54 cm of an inch. Whether the term is good or not, it has been used quite widely.--Gorpik (talk) 12:12, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

Cleanup

The tone and grammar of this article warrant serious revision (missing words, word order, etc.) Dustybunny (talk) 23:41, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

Workstations

It seems there were no workstations in the Soviet Bloc. Is that true? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Trasz (talk • contribs) 21:27, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

This article is incomplete.--Dojarca (talk) 11:20, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

What's the scope of this article?

If it's for large computers, then it should include ES EVM, SM EVM, Setun, Ural, BESM. If it's for personal computers, it should include Elektronika-60, DVK, Elektronika BK, UKNC, Agat, Korvet.--Dojarca (talk) 11:07, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Arcade machines

I have added a link about a museum of Soviet arcade machines that you may use to add information about them. --Error (talk) 23:34, 30 January 2010 (UTC)

Illegally copied

Was it illegal according the local laws or only according to Western laws? Are there court decisions and/or precedents considering legality? Did the western companies try to pursue their interests in the courts on the eastern block countries? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Anuclanus (talk • contribs) 10:15, 5 September 2011 (UTC)

I agree. The statement is not neutral. I have tagged it so that editors may provide input here. --Joshua Issac (talk) 22:16, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

Will remove. I believe was legal under Soviet law- at any rate was done by/for the government. The source given is CIA!178.176.2.180 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 16:36, 24 May 2012 (UTC).

In Soviet Russia ...

Computer programs YOU! 69.125.234.112 (talk) 00:29, 4 October 2012 (UTC)

RIMSHOT! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.223.130.32 (talk) 21:58, 25 October 2016 (UTC)

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