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Talk:CIA activities in Afghanistan

Latest comment: 2 years ago by Poroshjohn in topic Need Separate Article for 'Khost Protection Force which always redirect to this article's Khost Province
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Lead section edit

Latest comment: 14 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

I've removed the previous introduction, which was a thinly disguised rant against the Black Book of Communism. While I'm sure the criticisms have merit, they are not suitable for the lead section of an article. The statement was also largely inaccurate, as the above-mentioned work is only cited once, as far as I can see. I have inserted a basic placeholder introduction in the meantime. Cyril Washbrook (talk) 00:36, 6 April 2010 (UTC)Reply

External links modified edit

Latest comment: 8 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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External links modified edit

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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External links modified edit

Latest comment: 6 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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National Security Decision 166 edit

Latest comment: 6 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

The article says that the decision hasn't been declassified, but this must be outdated, Because it's here on the Reagan Presidential Library website. Aside from correcting the small detail, it could be used to expand the article. https://www.reaganlibrary.archives.gov/archives/reference/Scanned%20NSDDS/NSDD166.pdf — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2604:2D80:C404:8A77:B191:A707:3638:96C (talk) 04:19, 10 October 2017 (UTC)Reply

Hafizullah Amin edit

Latest comment: 6 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

The initial discussion of CIA activity in Afghanistan in 1979 mentions that Hafizullah Amin was "suspected [by the Soviets] of being an agent" working for the CIA; apparently this was deliberately stirred up by the KGB operating in Afghanistan to convince their Soviet bosses that direct intervention was required. — Sasuke Sarutobi (talk) 16:23, 27 March 2018 (UTC)Reply

Move discussion in progress edit

Latest comment: 2 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:CIA activities in Iraq which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 01:34, 1 August 2021 (UTC)Reply

Stinger edit

Latest comment: 2 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

The following text (not in italic) is more or less a translation from the German WP article and includes a couple more details including the surface-to-air missiles previously tested (unsuccessfully), nameley the Oerlikon and the Blowpipe. From my perspective, the debate if the Stinger actually forced out the Soviets out of Afghanistan should be included in the article (it's contested). So feel free to use some of the sections for the article (I usually refrain from making larger changes as a non-native English speaker, I am sure the text includes a couple of English errors).

During a visit to a refugee camp in Pakistan at the end of 1982, Charlie Wilson came to the conclusion that the armament of the mujahideen to defend themselves against the Mi-24 attack helicopters of the Soviet army was inadequate.[1] Wilson argued, the CIA would supply just enough weapons that many of the mujahideen would die in battle, but not enough to win the war.[2] While looking for a suitable weapon, he came across the Oerlikon 20 mm cannon from the Swiss company of the same name and urged the CIA to procure it for the operation in Afghanistan.[3] In Israel he commissioned the weapons manufacturer IMI Systems to develop an anti-aircraft missile.[4] The CIA and the ISI considered the Oerlikon too heavy to be transported with beasts of burden and were then forced to use the weapon for political reasons. Ultimately, the use of the Oerlikon proved to be a failure.[5][6]

The SA-7 surface-to-air missile was successfully used by the Egyptian army during the Yom Kippur War in 1973, but was no longer up to date in 1980.[7] After the failure of the Oerlikon, the CIA and MI6 procured the British Blowpipe man-portable surface-to-air missile in 1985, although it had not proven itself in the Falklands War in 1982.[8] With the Blowpipe, the shooter had to fire the rocket and steer it to the target by remote control while standing without cover. The use of the Blowpipe was also unsuccessful.[9] According to the official report, there were only two confirmed Blowpipe kills.[10]

During the 1980 election campaign, Ronald Reagan proposed equipping the mujahideen with Stinger surface-to-air missiles.[11] In contrast to the Blowpipe, it found its target independently with its heat-sensitive infrared seeker head after it was fired.[12] Conservatives led by Under Secretary of Defense for Policy Fred Iklé and the Republican Senator Orrin Hatch opened a campaign for the Stingers against opposition from the army, the CIA and the State Department. The CIA contested that the delivery of Stinger missiles would be inconsistent with the policy of plausible deniability.[13] The US support for the mujahideen had long since been an open secret by then. The US press had already reported about it and Egyptian President Anwar Sadat openly admitted the supply of Soviet weapons in an interview on US television in 1981.[14][15] The military objected because it feared the top-secret technology might fall into the hands of the Soviets. However, Moscow was already in possession of important technical data through a leak in Greece. There were also concerns that terrorists might get hold of the weapon. After negotiations with Pakistan and China, both countries agreed to the delivery and Zia made a formal request for the stingers.[16] Reagan approved the stinger shipment for Afghanistan in April 1986.[17] However, that decision was no longer a precedent at this point. In November 1985, Reagan had already approved the delivery of Stinger missiles to the UNITA in Angola.[18]

In September 1986, the Stinger was used for the first time in Afghanistan. A small mujahideen squad from Hekmatyar’s Hezb-e Islami managed to shoot down three Mi-24 attack helicopters during their approach to the Jalalabad airfield. As a first reaction, the Soviets suspended air operations in eastern Afghanistan for the next few weeks.[19] The Stinger caused a complete revision of their previous aerial tactics on the Soviet side. Aircraft and helicopters then flew at greater altitudes beyond the range of the Stingers, limited their flights during the day and repelled infrared decoy flares. After the initial shock, the Soviet countermeasures reduced the firing rate to what it was before the Stinger first appeared. The main effect of the Stingers was to reduce the threat of air strikes to the mujahideen.[20][21] Some authors consider the delivery of the Stingers to be crucial for the withdrawal of the Soviet Union.[22] Others object that it had no effect on this, because Mikhail Gorbachev made the decision to withdraw a year before a Stinger was used for the first time and the Stinger did not fundamentally change the course of the war.[21][23][24] Gorbachev himself had stated in an interview in 2010 that the Stinger did not influence his decision-making process.[25]

Soviet Minister of Defence Sergei Sokolov announced the first to acquire a Stinger would be awarded Hero of the Soviet Union. A Spetsnaz unit succeeded in capturing an intact Stinger for the first time in January 1987. During a military parade in 1987, Iran showed several Stinger missiles they had allegedly acquired from the mujahideen for one million US$.[21][26] In total, the CIA delivered around 2,000 to 2,500 Stinger missiles to mujahideen commanders. After the withdrawal of the Soviet Union, US President George H. W. Bush approved a secret program to buy back the Stingers. The retail price of a Stinger ranged from $80,000 to $150,000. According to estimates by the CIA, around 600 were still in circulation in 1996, around 100 of which were owned by Iran.[27] Some rockets fell into the possession of Al-Qaeda and the Taliban rejected an offer from the CIA in 1997 to buy back the approximately 50 Stinger rockets in their possession.[28][29] During the Kargil War in 1999, an Indian attack helicopter was shot down with a Stinger missile.[30] In the wake of the U.S. Intervention in Afghanistan after 9/11, the FBI learned from interrogations of bin Laden’s longtime bodyguard Nasser al-Bahri, who was detained in Yemen in 2000, that Al-Qaeda and the Taliban were chronically short of batteries for the Stingers.[31] --Jo1971 (talk) 20:36, 7 August 2021 (UTC)Reply

Need Separate Article for 'Khost Protection Force which always redirect to this article's Khost Province edit

Latest comment: 2 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Khost Protection Force is needed as a separate article. it always redirect to Khost province of this article. but there are so much information to have Khost Protection Force as a article. it is unable to create article for this caption. Porosh John 18:00, 27 August 2021 (UTC)Reply

References edit

  1. ^ Crile, George (2003). Charlie Wilson’s War. The Extraordinary Story of How the Wildest Man in Congress and a Rogue CIA Agent Changed the History of Our Times. New York: Grove Press. pp. 102–111. ISBN 978-0-8021-4341-9.
  2. ^ Coll, Steve (2005). Ghost Wars. The Secret History of the CIA, Afghanistan, and bin Laden, from the Soviet Invasion to September 10, 2001. New York: Penguin Books. pp. 91–92. ISBN 978-0-14-303466-7.
  3. ^ Crile, George (2003). Charlie Wilson’s War. The Extraordinary Story of How the Wildest Man in Congress and a Rogue CIA Agent Changed the History of Our Times. New York: Grove Press. pp. 213–215. ISBN 978-0-8021-4341-9.
  4. ^ Crile, George (2003). Charlie Wilson’s War. The Extraordinary Story of How the Wildest Man in Congress and a Rogue CIA Agent Changed the History of Our Times. New York: Grove Press. pp. 141–142. ISBN 978-0-8021-4341-9.
  5. ^ Yousaf, Mohammad; Adkin, Mark (2007). The Battle for Afghanistan. The Soviets Versus the Mujahideen During the 1980s. Barnsley: Pen & Sword Military. p. 87. ISBN 978-1-84415-616-0.
  6. ^ Crile, George (2003). Charlie Wilson’s War. The Extraordinary Story of How the Wildest Man in Congress and a Rogue CIA Agent Changed the History of Our Times. New York: Grove Press. p. 256. ISBN 978-0-8021-4341-9.
  7. ^ Riedel, Bruce (2014). What We Won. America’s Secret War in Afghanistan, 1979–89. Washington, D.C.: Brookings Institution Press. pp. 70–71. ISBN 978-0-8157-2595-4.
  8. ^ Riedel, Bruce (2014). What We Won. America’s Secret War in Afghanistan, 1979–89. Washington, D.C.: Brookings Institution Press. pp. 53, 118–119. ISBN 978-0-8157-2595-4.
  9. ^ Yousaf, Mohammad; Adkin, Mark (2007). The Battle for Afghanistan. The Soviets Versus the Mujahideen During the 1980s. Barnsley: Pen & Sword Military. pp. 88–89. ISBN 978-1-84415-616-0.
  10. ^ Lamb, Christina (2015). Farewell Kabul. From Afghanistan to a More Dangerous World. London: William Collins. p. 445. ISBN 978-0-00-725694-5.
  11. ^ Schram, Martin (1980-01-10). "Reagan Urges U.S. Mideast Presence". The Washington Post. Retrieved 2021-08-07.
  12. ^ Bearden, Milton; Risen, James (2003). The Main Enemy. The Inside Story of the CIA’s Final Showdown with the KGB. New York: Ballantine Books. p. 239. ISBN 0-345-47250-0.
  13. ^ Cordovez, Diego; Harrison, Selig S. (1995). Out of Afghanistan. The Inside Story of the Soviet Withdrawal. New York: Oxford University Press. pp. 194–195. ISBN 0-19-506294-9.
  14. ^ Riedel, Bruce (2014). What We Won. America’s Secret War in Afghanistan, 1979–89. Washington, D.C.: Brookings Institution Press. p. 106. ISBN 978-0-8157-2595-4.
  15. ^ Dupree, Louis (February 1983). "Afghanistan in 1982: And Still No Solution". Asian Survey. 23 (2): 137. doi:10.2307/2644344.
  16. ^ Cordovez, Diego; Harrison, Selig S. (1995). Out of Afghanistan. The Inside Story of the Soviet Withdrawal. New York: Oxford University Press. pp. 195–197. ISBN 0-19-506294-9.
  17. ^ Kengor, Paul (2007). The Crusader. Ronald Reagan and the Fall of Communism. New York: Harper Perennial. p. 259. ISBN 978-0-06-118924-1.
  18. ^ Gates, Robert M. (1996). From the Shadows. The Ultimate Insider’s Story of Five Presidents and How They Won the Cold War. New York: Simon & Schuster. p. 347. ISBN 0-684-81081-6.
  19. ^ Bearden, Milton; Risen, James (2003). The Main Enemy. The Inside Story of the CIA’s Final Showdown with the KGB. New York: Ballantine Books. pp. 240–244. ISBN 0-345-47250-0.
  20. ^ Grau, Lester W.; Gress, Michael A., eds. (2002). The Soviet-Afghan War. How a Superpower Fought and Lost. Lawrence: University Press of Kansas. p. 222. ISBN 0-7006-1185-1. {{cite book}}: Cite uses deprecated parameter |authors= (help)
  21. ^ a b c Braithwaite, Rodric (2011). Afgantsy. The Russians in Afghanistan 1979–1989. New York: Oxford University Press. pp. 203–205. ISBN 978-0-19-983265-1.
  22. ^ Kengor, Paul (2007). The Crusader. Ronald Reagan and the Fall of Communism. New York: Harper Perennial. p. 260. ISBN 978-0-06-118924-1.
  23. ^ Steele, Jonathan (2011). Ghosts of Afghanistan. The Haunted Battleground. Berkeley: Counterpoint. pp. 112–114. ISBN 978-1-58243-787-3.
  24. ^ Kuperman, Alan J.; Bearden, Milton (January 2002). "Stinging Rebukes". Foreign Affairs. Retrieved 2021-08-07.
  25. ^ Braithwaite, Rodric (2011). Afgantsy. The Russians in Afghanistan 1979–1989. New York: Oxford University Press. p. 369. ISBN 978-0-19-983265-1.
  26. ^ Engelberg, Stephen; Trainor, Bernard E. (1987-10-17). "Iranians Captured Stinger Missiles From Afghan Guerrillas, U.S. Says". The New York Times. Retrieved 2021-08-07.
  27. ^ Coll, Steve (2005). Ghost Wars. The Secret History of the CIA, Afghanistan, and bin Laden, from the Soviet Invasion to September 10, 2001. New York: Penguin Books. pp. 11–12. ISBN 978-0-14-303466-7.
  28. ^ Bergen, Peter (2001). Holy War, Inc. Inside the Secret World of Osama bin Laden. New York: Free Press. pp. 74–75. ISBN 0-7432-0502-2.
  29. ^ Coll, Steve (2005). Ghost Wars. The Secret History of the CIA, Afghanistan, and bin Laden, from the Soviet Invasion to September 10, 2001. New York: Penguin Books. pp. 337–340. ISBN 978-0-14-303466-7.
  30. ^ Rothermund, Dietmar (2002). Krisenherd Kaschmir. Der Konflikt der Atommächte Indien und Pakistan (in German). München: C. H. Beck. p. 103. ISBN 3-406-49424-2.
  31. ^ Bergen, Peter (2012). Manhunt. The Ten-Year Search for Bin Laden from 9/11 to Abbottabad. New York: Broadway Paperbacks. pp. 30–31. ISBN 978-0-307-95588-3.
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