Smasongarrison

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All Saints' Church

Can you please tell when I had been told about "changing ... to Kowloon", and elaborate what is wrong to mention Kowloon (given that the territory comprises four components – Kowloon being one of them?) Thanks. 58.152.55.172 (talk) 08:44, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

You are clearly Wikipedia:HKGW. Mason (talk) 13:36, 24 April 2024 (UTC)

@Underwaterbuffalo and WhisperToMe. 58.152.55.172 (talk) 08:49, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

This is called canvasing. Mason (talk) 13:33, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

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Administrators' newsletter – May 2024

News and updates for administrators from the past month (April 2024).

Administrator changes

Nyttend

• JohnOwens
• Killiondude
• MelanieN
• Nihonjoe

Bureaucrat changes

Nihonjoe

CheckUser changes

Joe Roe

Oversight changes

GeneralNotability

Guideline and policy news

• Phase I of the 2024 requests for adminship review has concluded. Several proposals have passed outright and will proceed to implementation, including creating a discussion-only period (3b) and administrator elections (13) on a trial basis. Other successful proposals, such as creating a reminder of civility norms (2), will undergo further refinement in Phase II. Proposals passed on a trial basis will be discussed in Phase II, after their trials conclude. Further details on specific proposals can be found in the full report.

Technical news

• Partial action blocks are now in effect on the English Wikipedia. This means that administrators have the ability to restrict users from certain actions, including uploading files, moving pages and files, creating new pages, and sending thanks. T280531

Arbitration

• The arbitration case Conflict of interest management has been closed.

Miscellaneous

• This may be a good time to reach out to potential nominees to ask if they would consider an RfA.
• A New Pages Patrol backlog drive is happening in May 2024 to reduce the number of unreviewed articles in the new pages feed. Currently, there is a backlog of over 15,000 articles awaiting review. Sign up here to participate!
• Voting for the Universal Code of Conduct Coordinating Committee (U4C) election is open until 9 May 2024. Read the voting page on Meta-Wiki and cast your vote here!

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Question about your username

Just curious: what does the "s" stand for? Best, HouseBlaster (talk · he/him) 00:26, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

My legal first name: Sarah. My parents drew inspiration from Sarah Michelle Gellar. Mason (talk) 00:27, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Law schools in CA

Hello, curious on this edit. Are these "Lincoln Law Schools" not law schools in California? --Engineerchange (talk) 23:30, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

The page is, but there's not a need to also classify the WP:EPONYMOUS category as well. There were only three other categories in Category:Law schools in California category, and I don't think everything in the category (or its category) was a law school in california (Wikipedia:Overcategorization). Mason (talk) 00:01, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

Ah yes, I always forget WP:EPONYMOUS. Thanks! --Engineerchange (talk) 01:36, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

please open a CFD discussion if you're going to be making mass changes to categories and emptying them out

Also, do you disagree with e.g. greek philosophers in the 13th century being byzantine philosophers? because otherwise I can't imagine why you would remove the Greek philosopher categories from the Byzantine one! Psychastes (talk) 01:35, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

Why did you revert my message, and then start a conversation over here? That seems misleading. Mason (talk) 01:37, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

I'm aware how WP:DEFINING works, and I read your message, so I didn't think it was necessary to keep that message on my talk page. You emptying categories out of process, however, is an issue that belongs on your user page. Psychastes (talk) 01:41, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

Well, I'm glad to hear that you know how defining works, because it wasn't clear from your categorization. In terms of removal out of process, you're right that I should have thought thru that removing the pages as I inspected them wasn't a good workflow. Mason (talk) 01:44, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi, I noticed that you've added a lot of Byzantine philosophers to Greek philosopher categories, when many of them aren't defined as being Greek, such as John of Damascus. Typically, we only add people to a nationality category if that nationality is WP:DEFINING for the person. Please review how nationality works before making more categories. Mason (talk) 01:29, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

on John of Damascus's article, it says John is at the end of the Patristic period of dogmatic development, and his contribution is less one of theological innovation than one of a summary of the developments of the centuries before him. In Catholic theology, he is therefore known as the "last of the Greek Fathers" and in my own experience he's referred to as a Greek philosopher as well. I suppose we might disagree on whether that counts as WP:DEFINING or not, but please don't talk to me like I'm somehow unaware of the policy! Psychastes (talk) 01:44, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

From my perspective it looked like you were massively moving everyone from byzantine philosophers into greek philsophers. Again, I'm glad to know that you know how defining works. Mason (talk) 01:48, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

more generally, do you disagree that "Byzantine" and "Greek" are somewhat interchangeable terms in the time period? I think there are probably people like John of Damascus who might be on the border of if we want to call them "Byzantine/Greek" at all, but Category:Byzantine people is in Category:Greek people by period, so unless you want to make a massive change to the whole category tree, your edits are almost certainly incorrect. Psychastes (talk) 01:51, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

I don't have a very strong opinion on byzantine versus greek. I don't think it is a clear cut issue. But I'd view byztantine as the broader category during its empire's existence. Like I think you could classify anyone in the empire as byztantine, but only people in the area that's now greece as greek. Like I think it would have been more straight forward to place these philosophers into Xth century Byzatine philosophers, instead. Mason (talk) 01:56, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

well, that's not how the category tree is structured, so if you'd like to change that I'd recommend opening a discussion at CfD. I will probably revert your recent edits based on the fact that they are inconsistent with how all other Byzantine people are categorized currently, unless you want to do so yourself. Psychastes (talk) 01:58, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

I still think it would have been more straight forward if you had created Xth century Byzatine philosophers, instead. FWIW: I already restored the Byzantine categories. Mason (talk) 02:00, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

im going to restore the people as well. if you want to change the name of the category that's another thing to bring to CFD Psychastes (talk) 02:05, 9 May 2024 (UTC)

Re recent edit Eric Malthouse page

Welsh, Scottish, English and Northern Ireland people/artists are all British. Therefore there is a fault with the 20th-century British male artists category as it should contain all Welsh, Scottish, English and Northern Ireland artists. It is an insult to some Welsh, Scottish and Northern Irish artists to say they are not British. I hope this problem can be resolved. Neutron6 (talk) 23:06, 11 May 2024 (UTC)

The Category:20th-century British male artists category does contain all Welsh, Scottish, English and Northern Ireland artists. Each of those is a child category, which means in this case that everyone in those categories is also British. The long standing practice is for those categories to be diffused. No one is saying that Welsh, Scottish and Northern Irish artists are not British. Please review the category structure and how diffusion works. Mason (talk) 23:10, 11 May 2024 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Category:1995 disasters in Belgium

A tag has been placed on Category:1995 disasters in Belgium indicating that it is currently empty, and is not a disambiguation category, a category redirect, a featured topics category, under discussion at Categories for discussion, or a project category that by its nature may become empty on occasion. If it remains empty for seven days or more, it may be deleted under section C1 of the criteria for speedy deletion.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and removing the speedy deletion tag. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 16:51, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

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Alumni by department

I believe degrees are technically granted at the College/school lebrl in a university, not at the department level. So my Wayne State degree is from the Collehe of Arts and Sciences, not the History department. Even at that undergrad alumni often range widely in studies, so it often only really makes sense to sub-divide grad student alumni by college or school, and to unify all undergrad alumni . At least at some US universities.John Pack Lambert (talk) 04:42, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

Yep that's my understanding of degrees as well. I do think that we can divide up grad alumni more, which would help a lot with those overcrowded categories. But, I'm not sure unifying all undergrad would be helpful as that seems like it would make the categories even more crowded, especially if they're already divided up by school of engineering etc. But, still, it is an interestiong thought. Mason (talk) 04:49, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

In the case of Harvard University, all undergrads are in Harvard College. There is 1 unified structure for undergrads. It is different at say the University of Michigan, where they do have undergrads in the College of Engineering, etc. However large size is not the worst possible outcome in categories. We want categories to be relevant. For most sports people the degree they got from the university is not going to be defining, and this is actually true for lots of other people. Grad degrees tend more to be defining, although there are exceptions there. Undergrad degrees tend less so. In my own experience as a grad student at Eastern Michigan University, all the courses I took were through the history department. As an undergrad at Wayne State University and elsewhere I took a lot of course through other departments. At my first university close to half of the courses I took were not from the college that the history department was in, maybe even more than half. In fact at my first university since for a time I was trying to do the education tract, I was on a course to essentially get a dual degree since high school education degrees were jointly from one of 4 colleges (physical and mathematical sciences, life sciences <which changed names> , humanities and basically social sciences (which included history and geography). Actually fine arts had education degrees, and when I was there there was also a college of health and human performance that cosponsored education degrees, physical education has since been moved to the college of education, health education was essentially moved to life sciences, dance education to the extent it existed was basically put in Fine Arts <most dance majors were not dance education>, and then a part went to the business school, that was not education related per se. I really think that in general undergrad degrees are not defining enough to be worth categorizing by. With grad degrees, I think it is mainly specific professional program connections we want to categorize by.John Pack Lambert (talk) 15:52, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

Category question: human rights agencies

Hi Mason, question for you. Is there a category for human rights government agencies, the ones that are charged with administering human rights laws? There is one for "Human rights organizations", with numerous sub-cats, but those strike me as being about groups that lobby for human rights. I think that human rights commissions or agencies are different from that kind of group, but can't find a category for them? Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 22:54, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Not that I'm aware of. But that sounds like a great idea! Mason (talk) 22:55, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

I don’t want to do something that results in a CfD again, like my innocent attempt at categories for pre-Confederation lawyers! Would this work?

• There is an existing global category :Human Rights.
• it’s got sub-cats, arranged first by symbols, (which I don’t understand ?), and then alphabetically.
• could I create a general sub-cat, in the alphabetical list? Something like “Category : Human rights enforcement agencies”?
• and then within that subcategory, have an additional sub-sub-cat by country? “Category : Human rights enforcement agencies in Canada”, “Category : Human rights enforcement agencies in the United States” and so on?
• the reason for this approach is that in some countries, notably the US, there will likely be a lot of agencies, so dividing by country will keep it manageable.

Does this sound workable? Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 23:50, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Gotcha! Makes sense. What you've written here sounds reasonable in terms of structure and styling and nesting. Let me see if I can find a sibling category. Given me about 5 minutes. Mason (talk) 23:55, 18 May 2024 (UTC)

Plausible sibling families could include: Category:Financial regulatory authorities of the United States... O.o!!!! Category:Human rights ministries, might be good to build off of! Mason (talk) 00:02, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

What are sibling families, please? Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 00:08, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Lol, I meant sibling categories. After digging around I like your suggested category structure. I think it fits well. So the main category would be Human rights enforcement agencies, and for the united states that category would be parented by Category : Human rights in the United States, Government agencies of the United States, Human rights organizations based in the United states. Mason (talk) 00:10, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I’ll try setting it up. Thanks for the suggestions and encouragement. Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 00:25, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

sure thing! Happy to help :) Mason (talk) 00:27, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

There, I've started it. I've got all of the Canadian articles categorised, some of the US. Added in UK and French. Will do India tomorrow; getting late here. Category : Human rights enforcement agencies. Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 04:46, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Hi Mason, thanks for fixing up my categories. However, I'm afraid I don't understand the changes, and now I can't seem to link the Indian category properly. The Indian category shows up on the parent page as empty, and the three commissions I've tried to do are listed individually on the parent page: Category : Human rights enforcement agencies. Could you take a look? Thanks. Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 13:38, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I was trying to mimic what you did with the piping, but I obviously didn't get it right. Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 13:42, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

Happy to explain. What aspects don't you understand about the additional categories? Like why I added them? Mason (talk) 15:13, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

In terms of the piping, so piping is used to change how pages/categories are sorted when you look at a category page. You still need to place the page in the category directly. For example, Category:Human rights enforcement agencies in the United States.

[[Category:Human rights enforcement agencies|united]], uses "united" so that Category:Human rights enforcement agencies in the United States, is sorted by U in that category, so that you can find it compared to the other countries.

[[Category:Government agencies of the United States|Human rights]], uses "Human rights" so that Category:Human rights enforcement agencies in the United States, is sorted by H in that category, so that you can find it compared to the subject of other agencies

[[Category:Human rights in the United States| agencies ]] uses " agencies" with a space, so that Category:Human rights enforcement agencies in the United States, shows up at the top of the category, so that you can find it without having to distinguish it from specific human rights.

[[Category:Human rights organizations based in the United States|agencies ]] uses "agencies" (no space) so that Category:Human rights enforcement agencies in the United States, is sorted by "agency" so that it is intermixed with other organizations. Mason (talk) 15:22, 19 May 2024 (UTC)

I don't have any problems with your changes - it's my lack of technical skills! I started editing the Indian commissions, trying to follow the patterns you used for the Canadian entries, but I couldn't make them work for the Indian ones, so I stopped; didn't want to make things worse. I see you've done some edits to the Indian ones; will take a look and try to wrap my head around this coding. I appreciate your help. Mr Serjeant Buzfuz (talk) 15:44, 19 May 2024 (UTC)