Important notice: Prior consensus has decided that Taiwan is to be referred to as a country.
Changes to the article to refer to Taiwan as a state, island, province of China, or other definition are not permitted and may be reverted. See here for the 2020 RfC in which editors reached this decision.
Please do not add Simplified characters and tongyong pinyin to the country infobox.
Please refrain from adding "(Taiwan)" all over the article as this article includes substantial information about the Republic of China prior to the Taiwan post-war era.
This article has previously been nominated to be moved.
Discussions on this page often lead to previous arguments being restated, especially about "country" vs "state", and "Taiwan" vs "Republic of China", and "Taiwan is a part of China", and "Taiwan is a province of China". Please read recent comments and look in the archives before commenting on that topic.
Please stay calm and civil while commenting or presenting evidence, and do not make personal attacks. Be patient when approaching solutions to any issues. Ifconsensus is not reached, other solutions exist to draw attention and ensure that more editors mediate or comment on the dispute.
Determine whether Taiwan should be called a 'country' or 'state'
Complete: Consensus has been reached for Taiwan to be called a 'country'. The consensus was 33 for country, 10 for state, and 5 for some variation of state. Here is the page on which consensus was reached
Add a short section about the culture and the geography of the ROC territories (with links to the main articles)
Review alt text of images
Should the role and influence of Sun Yat-sen be introduced in the History section?
Taiwan was one of the Geography and places good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
Keoni Everington (2020-06-15). "Wikipedia finally designates Taiwan as 'country'". Taiwan News. Retrieved 2020-06-16. In a request for comments (RFC) page created to debate the proper status of Taiwan in its Wikipedia entry, editors in May fiercely debated the merits of referring to Taiwan as a "state" or a "country."
Text and/or other creative content from this version of Taiwan was copied or moved into Sports in Taiwan with this edit on 22 October 2019. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists.
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The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The description of Kosovo states:
"Kosovo, officially the Republic of Kosovo, is a is a country in Southeast Europe with partial diplomatic recognition."
I see no reason why Kosovo (recognized by 104 UN members) should have the "partial diplomatic recognition" and Taiwan (recognized by 12 UN members) shouldn't. Either make both have the "with partial diplomatic recognition" part, or make neither have it. 2604:3D08:8B80:F00:8CB1:B64A:6D54:E344 (talk) 20:49, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Did you at all check what situations WP:OTHERSTUFF refers to? Or just trying to impress an IP editor with a cryptic acronym? — kashmīrīTALK 21:08, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
It is not an acronym. It is not argument to have the wording of the article on Taiwan changed because of the wording in the one on Kosovo. And to make an ultimatum to boot ("either both or neither") is not helping either. soetermans. ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 21:25, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I agree. I see no reason to treat Taiwan differently than, say, Abkhazia, South Ossetia or Kosovo as regards their recognition. — kashmīrīTALK 21:07, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
The difference is those other states are relatively recent breakaway states, while Taiwan is an older rump state that emerged from a civil war. Much harder to summarise recognition, which is not as a new breakaway state as it is for the other examples given. CMD (talk) 21:17, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Kosovo, although recent, is a fully functional country with no countries to back it up (like Turkey for Northern Cyprus, or Russia for Abkhazia/South Ossetia). It is just as much of a functional state as Taiwan. Just because a state is older does not mean it is automatically more legitimate. 2604:3D08:8B80:F00:8CB1:B64A:6D54:E344 (talk) 21:44, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
"Recency" does not automatically give a state more legitimacy. South Sudan broke away from Sudan in 2011, but no one disputes that it is a country, simply because there are no states that explicitly do not recognize South Sudan. Game2Winter (talk) 21:51, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I do: they're different countries that arose from different situations. Remsense诉 21:45, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I don't think any states are legitimate or illegitimate. I think my editorial instinct would be that the "partial recognition" guff should be removed from Kosovo, but I haven't edited that article. This is why "well what about other articles" arguments are usually seen as absurd barring any overarching editorial policy. Remsense诉 21:47, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Diplomatic recognition has nothing to do with legitimacy – it's a unilateral act of other states that may be done with or without a reason. When a state has been recognised by all or nearly all other sovereign states, its recognition does not rise to the point of having to be mentioned in the lead. However, when a state enjoys only limited recognition or none at all, the general practice on Wikipedia is to mention this fact in the lead section – and it's rather independent of the country's age. — kashmīrīTALK 22:01, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Why is it mentioned in Kosovo's lead section and not Taiwan's? Can you name anything specific that makes the situations different? Game2Winter (talk) 22:06, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
No idea, and I'm all for including this info in Taiwan article. — kashmīrīTALK 22:29, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
My position is the precise degree of international recognition or number of recognizing states is not useful in an infobox. Those points should be discussed in the article body, which they are. Remsense诉 02:15, 19 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
The information is indeed already discussed in the article. I am generally against adding this in the infobox. I would be supportive of dropping this language in the Kosovo infobox as well, FWIW. Butterdiplomat (talk) 02:41, 19 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Taiwan as a sovereign state inherited from the former Chinese Republic, As a nation in its own right that is existed long before the establishment of communist China and never be placed under the PRC rule in history, therefore no one would actually consider Taiwan as a PRC province or a breakaway state seceded from the PRC, despite being asserted by the communist regime as such. The cross-strait relations are basically two rival states vying for their legitimacy of "China", so it's in fact more similar to the current situation of Two Koreas, in which both Koreas are regarded as "countries" as well, and simultaneously they have been claiming the legitimacy over entire Korean peninsula in their respective constitution that is similar to the cross-strait relations. This circumstance would not affect the way we have viewed them as two sovereign countries exercise sovereignty in their each actual-controlled territories, rather than seeing them as “One Korea” with two governments, same applies to the ROC and PRC. Sheherherhers (talk) 13:37, 23 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Let's refocus: couch this argument in terms of why it makes the Taiwan article specifically better, or don't bother. If you want to change Kosovo, discuss that there—that article is irrelevant here, that's not generally how Wikipedia works. Remsense诉 21:54, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Good idea, I'll see if I can try to get it done. Game2Winter (talk) 21:59, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I think the better solution if you want to standardize is to drop that language from Kosovo, that does appear to be what your primarily interested in after all. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 02:10, 19 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I am in favor of this argument. It is too on the 'other states' section on the soverign states wikipage, (List of sovereign states#Other states), and is put there alongside Abkhazia, and Kosovo. While a large portion of nations recognize both of these entities, it is still there. Taiwan should be no different. BerlinEagle (talk) 01:46, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Latest comment: 1 month ago5 comments3 people in discussion
My edit of Douliu was removed and reverted by @Canterbury Tail as "disruptive". I added Taiwan Province as a first level followed by Yunlin County as a second level division. We have a big problem regarding ROC administrative divisions in the free area. So how about this: I'm opening up an RfC if we can propose two options in regards to the ROC subdivisions.
A. First level:
Provinces: Taiwan, Fuchien
Special Municipalities: Taipei, Kaohsiung, New Taipei, Tainan, Taichung, Taoyuan
Special Municipalities: Taipei, Kaohsiung, New Taipei, Tainan, Taichung, Taoyuan
While Google Maps and some maps online treat option B as main subdivisions, do you guys want the Province on the Infobox in its second, third and fourth level subdivision articles?
It's worth noting that Macau SAR got rid of parish governments in 2001 while Lithuania abolished county governments in 2010. The ROC kept Taiwan and Fuchien provinces for administrative and statistical purposes within the government especially the ROC Ministry of Interior still uses it. Getting rid of provinces from the ROC administrative structure would provoke the PRC.
I am inclined to oppose any framework that uses [[Taiwan|Republic of China]], since it clearly goes against the spirit of WP:COMMONNAME. I’m also inclined to oppose including Taiwan Province in the infobox just because it has no administrative function practically. Butterdiplomat (talk) 23:01, 8 May 2024 (UTC)Reply
Taiwan Province only covers Penghu, 10 counties on Taiwan island, but it could be included with the exception of six municipalities. However, Fujian can stay for Kinmen and Matsu. Silence of Lambs (talk) 20:47, 9 May 2024 (UTC)Reply
Latest comment: 19 days ago1 comment1 person in discussion
Add Republic of China (Taiwan) as an official name in the first sentence.
According to Taiwan government website, Republic of China (Taiwan) is the official name.
https://www.taiwan.gov.tw/about.phpJDCohan (talk) 03:26, 25 May 2024 (UTC)Reply
Grammar fix in image caption in section "Relations with the PRC"; "Ma–Xi meeting was the first" should be "The Ma–Xi meeting..." 104.232.119.107 (talk) 03:26, 1 June 2024 (UTC)Reply