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Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of international goals scored by Wayne Rooney/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by SchroCat 21:24, 29 August 2015 [1].

List of international goals scored by Wayne Rooney edit

List of international goals scored by Wayne Rooney (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

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Nominator(s): The Rambling Man (talk) 13:07, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Rooooney. His goals and his imminent passing of Bobby Charlton's all-time scoring record for England have been the subject of many discussions over the past few months, so I thought I'd bang this into shape. I would be interested to see what the community here think could be improved/added/removed. As always, my thanks all of you who contribute, in whatever form, to the process. The Rambling Man (talk) 13:07, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Lemonade51 (talk) 16:00, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Brief comments
  • "Wayne Rooney made his debut for the England in a 3–1 defeat...."
    Fixed, thanks. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:55, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Although Ref 3 confirms Rooney broke Owen's record, I don't see it confirming it was against Morocco.
    Ref added, thanks. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:55, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Could have extra tables for 'by opponent' or 'by competition'? Lemonade51 (talk) 17:45, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    Could do, but that's covered in the prose. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:55, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your comments! The Rambling Man (talk) 18:55, 17 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Some more, mostly to do with sources...

Lemonade51 (talk) 15:02, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

All done, thanks! The Rambling Man (talk) 15:09, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Support on style and structure. Rooney's goalscoring record in the tournaments, particularly the World Cup is often scrutinised. Just an idea, you could rephrase "He has scored a single goal in the World Cup finals," to "...only scored once..." to reflect this? Lemonade51 (talk) 16:00, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks again, have tweaked as you suggested. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:20, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Comments from West Virginian
  • Support: The Rambling Man, I've completed my review and re-review of this nominated list, and I find that it meets the criteria for Wikipedia:Featured list criteria. Per Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Lead section, the list's lede adequately stands alone as a concise overview of Rooney's international goals. The image of Rooney is licensed CC BY-SA 3.0 and is therefore suitable for use here. This image does need an "alt" citation, though. Also, Macedonia national football team should be wiki-linked in the lede, since England and Australia's national teams are. Lemonade51 addressed the only other issues with the list, which look to have been sufficiently answered. Thank you for writing another featured-worthy list and congratulations on a job well done. -- West Virginian (talk) 04:30, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    Hi West Virginian, thanks for your support and your comments. I've added alt text, but Macedonia is already linked on its first appearance in the text. Cheers! The Rambling Man (talk) 07:13, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • This list needs some kind of visual tally by year and by competition. Nergaal (talk) 18:42, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    Please explain why you think that's required. I can add something but your comment is unclear, by competition is clear from the table and the prose, by year, is that really needed or is it just stats? Thanks for your comment. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:55, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from Harrias
Comment: I can't help but think that this list would benefit from being sortable? Harrias talk 20:35, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • You win the £5. I had thought that myself, and I'll do that, but it takes TIME and effort to get all the sort templates done. I had hoped that I'd catered for all the "sorting" questions (e.g. opponents, stadia most scored) in the lead, but if you insist, then I'll have to spend a few hundred thousand hours working it. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:37, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Another comment: the list says "England score shown first." But that doesn't seem to be the case for the first half of the list. It does hold true for roughly #33 onwards, but not before that? Or am I misreading? Harrias talk 20:53, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Good spot, I'll go through it all tomorrow, try to make it sortable, damn you, and get back to you. Thanks for your interest. The Rambling Man (talk) 20:55, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
No worries, I'm playing around in my sandbox (well, one of them) with a similar list for Bobby Charlton. So I was looking quite closely at this list for guidance! Harrias talk 20:57, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
What would be REALLY helpful would be a bot or script that turned bare dates into sortable dates... The Rambling Man (talk) 20:59, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
I'm learning some coding at the moment in an effort to be able to come up with useful scripts like that. But don't hold your breath, at least not for this FLC! Harrias talk 21:01, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Check out my recent edit..... Wow! The Rambling Man (talk) 21:05, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Cheat. Harrias talk 21:07, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, and removed false note, England score isn't first. It's just standard home team-away team, so I've destroyed that claim. The Rambling Man (talk) 21:07, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Harrias fully sortable now, what do you reckon? The Rambling Man (talk) 05:47, 19 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Sorting looks good, though I'm not convinced of the usefulness of the "Score" column being sortable. But it can't harm I guess.
  • I know it is the general format convention, but it looks odd have YYYY FIFA World Cup, and UEFA Euro YYYY. Would there be any worth in making it FIFA World Cup YYYY to keep the two consistent within the list?
    I'm keeping it consistent with the reset of Wikipedia's articles on these things, it makes me wonder though if we need a wider discussion to move them all inline with one another. The Rambling Man (talk) 07:48, 20 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Is there a need to link London? I'd say that the Republic of Macedonia is in more need of a link than London!
    I'm just trying to be consistent, some readers know where Skopje is, some know where Manchester is, so I can either link all the cities, or none of them, all of the countries or none of them, I don't think I can judge on every reader's behalf what places are and are not obvious.... The Rambling Man (talk) 07:48, 20 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Do we have another relevant picture to kill some of the whitespace next to the Goals and appearances per year table? (Which could also be made sortable *wink*) Harrias talk 07:23, 20 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    I'll take a look! The Rambling Man (talk) 07:48, 20 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    Harrias all responded to or addressed, cheers. The Rambling Man (talk) 07:52, 20 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Some of the scores look the wrong way around. #32, #34, #35, #36, #39, #43, #45, #46. Harrias talk 07:23, 20 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    Harrias: wow, stoopid me, and sorry for taking so long to notice your comment. Fixed now I think? The Rambling Man (talk) 18:21, 20 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support, yup looks good to me now! Harrias talk 07:12, 22 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Support from Tim riley edit

As an ancestral Evertonian it goes against the grain to support anything to do with the goblinesque defector, but this FLC seems to me to meet all the criteria. Dammit. Tim riley talk 20:39, 18 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from NapHit (talk) 22:15, 19 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Comments
  • This might seem a little silly, but it's not mentioned anywhere that Rooney is a footballer. Perhaps this is worth adding in the first sentence somewhere?
  • "Rooney has never scored an international hat-trick although he has scored twice in a match on ten occasions." Comma after hat-trick?
  • I only count four goals during Euro 2004, not the five stated in the lead
  • "Statistics accurate as of match played 7 June 2015" full stop at the end?

This is an excellent list and a novel idea that will surely catch on. Fantastic work. NapHit (talk) 20:04, 19 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed as you suggested. Thanks for your comments! The Rambling Man (talk) 21:05, 19 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Support Great work. NapHit (talk) 22:15, 19 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  • Support - It will be the first FL for international goals unless I'm mistaken and it sets a nice template for future articles of this type. The prose flows really smoothly even though it is incredibly stat-heavy, which is a great achievement. Spiderone 11:53, 26 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support - as second-equal top scorer or as the second-equal top scorer - and one behind or and behind. Other than this, the list is very well written and made.--Cheetah (talk) 06:52, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from Mattythewhite (talk) 20:47, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Comments from Mattythewhite
  • "As of August 2015": should this not be the date of his last cap?
    Well both are valid. Both are true. And quite possibly I'll need to update this list in a week or so's time. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:14, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "He has only scored once in the World Cup finals, in a 2–1 loss to Uruguay": which World Cup?
    Added. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:14, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Per WP:DTAB, tables should have captions to describe their nature.
    I thought only if it wasn't obvious, e.g. if it follows on from a heading. Anyway, added a caption. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:14, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • In the prose the FIFA/UEFA acronyms are not included, but in the list they are; should be consistent.
    I tend to disagree here. In the list, they are designed to link to specific articles, but in the prose it becomes very awkward to keep mentioning UEFA, FIFA every time when we simply don't do that in common parlance. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:14, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Republic of Macedonia": just Macedonia? If we were to write out the official names of every country, we'd have the Portuguese Republic, Kingdom of Denmark etc.
    Removed. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:14, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "San Marino Stadium": no settlement, unlike the other venues.
    Added. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:14, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Statistics are accurate as of match played 7 June 2015": I should hope not, seeing as Rooney was last capped on 15 June 2015!
    Reused note from previous table. The Rambling Man (talk) 18:14, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, Mattythewhite (talk) 16:36, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

No, thank you. I believe I've responded to and/or addressed your concerns, cheers! The Rambling Man (talk) 18:14, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support, not that I think it needs any more support !votes...! Mattythewhite (talk) 20:47, 29 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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