Wikipedia

Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of Olympic men's ice hockey players for Canada/archive1

< Wikipedia:Featured list candidates‎ | List of Olympic men's ice hockey players for Canada
The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by Matthewedwards 21:45, 14 April 2009 [1].

List of Olympic men's ice hockey players for Canada edit

Nominator(s): Scorpion0422
Toolbox

This is my first ever List of players FLC (and I'm in no hurry to do any more). A few notes:

This morning I split the List of Olympic women's ice hockey players for Canada off from this page (previous combined version). I was somewhat divided on it, and it is somewhathippocritical coming from me considering the current criteria discussion, but I brought the issue up at WT:HOCKEY and there was a lot of support. I'm kind of split on the issue, because having it all in one page is useful since both are for the same sport at the Olympics. However, the two are different disciplines with completely different rosters and no interlap. The List of Toronto Maple Leafs players doesn't include a list of Toronto Marlies players (in fact, I think you could make a better case for combining those two than these two). Because it's two seperate events the text really reflected that and jumped back and forth between them (especially in the the lead, you can tell that the summary of the women's event was just thrown in) and having seperate pages allows both to have the proper attention they deserve.
Images: Likely not to be an issue, but there is recentism in the images although there's not much that can be done about that. My choosing order was images of players in Team Canada uniforms, then gold medalists, then medalists, then players from pre-2002 teams, then 2006 non-medalists. So if any more become available, the images of the '06 players would be first to go.
The List of Olympic women's ice hockey players for Canada will likely be coming this way once this FLC is closed.

And that is all. As always, all concerns will be addressed by me. Enjoy. -- Scorpion0422 17:04, 2 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved comments from Truco
General
Lead
  • In 1962, Canada implemented a national team program, led by Father David Bauer. -- Father? Is that proper?
  • Well, it is his common name.
  • The Soviet Union began competing in 1956 and became a dominant team. -- its a bit POV-ish to say they were dominant without backing it up with credentials.
  • I don't think it's POV (if winning 7 gold medals in 9 tournaments doesn't make you dominant, I don't know what does) and in order to back it up I would have to add more explanation which would go off-topic.
  • Why don't you state that then (that they have won 7 gold medals in 9 tourneys)--Best, TRUCO 22:58, 2 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry to interrupt, but I too think that calling a team "dominant" is POV.—Chris! ct 02:08, 3 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, but if its backed up with reasons as to the dominance, its fine.--Best, TRUCO 00:30, 4 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Many of the Canada's top players were professional, so the Canadian Amateur Hockey Association (CAHA) pushed for the ability to use professional and amateur players.
  • Done.
  • The NHL decided not to allow all players to participate in 1988, 1992 or 1994, but an agreement was reached in 1995 to allow NHL players could to play in the Olympics starting with the 1998 Games in Nagano, Japan.
  • Done.
  • The Canadian Olympic Hall of Fame has inducted three individuals and four gold medal winning teams: the 1920 Winnipeg Falcons, 1948 RCAF Flyers, 1952 Edmonton Mercurys and the 2002 team. -- you mean The Canadian Olympic Hall of Fame has inducted three individuals and four gold medal winning teams: the 1920 Winnipeg Falcons, 1948 RCAF Flyers, and 1952 and 2002 Edmonton Mercurys?
  • No, the Edmonton Mercurys were just the 1952 team. The 2002 team was a national team. I'll see what I can do.
  • Okay, tell me what you can do.--Best, TRUCO 22:58, 2 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • A group of around 45 players will be invited to an orientation camp in August 2009 (although players not invited can also be named to the team) and the final roster will be announced in December. -- IDK, but I like the word about better than around, but that's just me.
  • Fixed.
Reserve goaltenders
  • Martin Brodeur and Curtis Joseph did not play in any games at the 1998 Winter Olympics but did start games at later tournaments -- Comma needed before but
  • Done.
Tables in general
  • The notes should not be sortable.
  • I disagree, it's useful if you want to sort by which members are Hall of Fame inductees or who the team captains and flag bearers were.
I guess since that's all they are used for.--Best, TRUCO 22:58, 2 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • I also question the sortability of some columns which have cells that have more than one entry.--Best, ₮RUCӨ 21:10, 2 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • It's an unfortunate glitch, but it only affects a few entries. Being able to sort by the year they competed and medal type is very useful. Thanks for taking a look. -- Scorpion0422 22:17, 2 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Okay I guess its fine.--Best, TRUCO 22:58, 2 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support -- Previous issues resolved; article now meets WP:WIAFL. Great work.--Best, TRUCO 00:30, 4 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - Shouldn't this link be placed at a see also section?—Chris! ct 19:07, 4 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Possibly, but List of Olympic ice hockey players for Canada redirects here, so I figured a hatnote was best. -- Scorpion0422 21:20, 4 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, I think List of Olympic ice hockey players for Canada should be a disambiguous page and then put List of Olympic women's ice hockey players for Canada in a see also section.—Chris! ct 22:07, 4 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I dislike that idea, it seems like an unnecessary disambiguation for an unlikely dearch term and the hatnote isn't particularily obtrusive. -- Scorpion0422 15:59, 7 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comments
    • "...and added to the Winter Olympic Games ..." so it was in Summer and Winter games after this?
      • No, just winter. fixed.
    • "Between 1920 and 1952, Canada won six gold medals.." how many Olympics did this constitute? I imagine the 2nd World War caused at least one if not two Olympiads to be cancelled. So much so that this is a serious period of dominance for Canada that isn't really emphasised here, and it should be.
      • Fixed. Switched it to "Between 1920 and 1952, seven Olympic ice hockey tournemtns were held and Canada won six gold medals and a silver in 1936"
    • Confused as to why the Canadian Amateur Hockey Association would push for professionals to be used if they were an amateur organisation.
      • The CAHA was in charge of Olympic and World Championship hockey teams and they wanted to use the best players.
    • "The NHL decided not to allow all players to participate in ..." - why?
      • I didn't add it because I didn't want to trail too far off subject. I have now added "because doing so would force the league to halt play during the Olympics"
    • Medal sorting - hmm. Typically one Olympic Gold is better than a gazillion Silvers, one Silver better than a trazillion Bronze. Don't you think your table should sort the way most international representation of Olympics medal tables sort? Or is it the US approach (in Beijing) where a nation has more Golds but a "home nation" has a bigger total, it sorts in their favour?
      • Wait, what are you referring to? When I click sort, the blank spaces go to the top, then the gold, then the silver, then the bronze. (or are you referring to the cells with two medals? I went in chronological order with those)
        • So, if I click sort on medals, the up arrow starts with blank cells, then 1 gold...2 silver...2 silver 1 gold...2 silver 2 silver...2 silver 1 gold...3 bronze....3 bronze 2 silver...3 bronze... and the other way round (with the arrow pointing down) I get 3 bronze....3 bronze 2 silver....3 bronze....2 silver 1 gold....2 silver...2 silver 2 silver...2 silver 1 gold...1 gold... blank cells. So, first off it's not "opposite" sorting, and secondly it seems all a little out of kilter to me... The Rambling Man (talk) 22:50, 4 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
          • Okay, I've gone through and fixed the sorting. It now goes multi-medalists then gold, silver, bronze, blanks. I even fixed it so that the medal types will automatically sort in chronological order. -- Scorpion0422 23:36, 4 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
    • A few of your players link to an article about players who have featured in the NHL only once. Isn't this a little misleading if they don't have their own article?
      • Yes, but the links have to go somewhere.
        • Yes but you have a number of red links for those guys without articles. Why confuse readers with links to another list when they don't have articles there either? The Rambling Man (talk) 22:50, 4 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
          • What is it you're suggesting then? Just remove the links or intentionally make them red? -- Scorpion0422 23:00, 4 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
            • I guess I'd make them red links. They must be inherently notable to make the list so make them red links and someone will create a stub. 23:03, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
  • The Rambling Man (talk) 22:16, 4 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from Giants2008
Comments - Couldn't ask for a bigger list. Only found a few things during a reading of the list:
  • "Between 1920 and 1952, seven Olympic ice hockey tournemtns were held...". Typo.
    • Fixed.
  • The part about the Soviet Union feels thrown in, without anything to do with the Canadians. Perhaps it should be tweaked to show the impact of the Soviet teams on Canada's performance.
    • See the above bit for why it was added. I'll try to relate it more.
  • "and six into the Canada's Sports Hall of Fame." Remove "the" to improve grammar.
    • Fixed.
  • Remove the period from the 2006 team photo's caption. Giants2008 (17-14) 22:11, 6 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Support - All looks good now. Giants2008 (17-14) 00:08, 10 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Support, all issues resolved. Dabomb87 (talk) 02:32, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved issues, Dabomb87 (talk)
Comments from Dabomb87 (talk · contribs)
  • "The men's tournament was introduced at the 1920 Summer Olympics, and permanently added to the Winter Olympic Games in 1924." You mention that it was introduced in the Summer Olympics and added to the Winter Games. However, you don't say anything about whether it was continued at the Summer Games. Perhaps "and transferred to the Winter Olympic Games"
    • Well, you have to remember that this is just a quick introduction, so it doesn't need to be completely in depth.
  • "were not allowed to play" I think "compete" is a better work here.
    • Done.
  • "ability to use professional" I don't think "use" is the correct word here, maybe "send out"?
    • I'm not the best person to ask, but I think use is the correct word as this is a team sport so one would use players on a team rather than send out players on a team.
  • "starting with 1988"-->, starting with the 1988 Games (and delink the current linked occurence of the 1988 Games)
    • In 1988 there were both Summer and Winter Olympics, so it would be just 1988. I fixed it to "starting in 1988"
  • "in the Olympics starting" Comma after here. Dabomb87 (talk) 22:53, 7 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for taking a look. -- Scorpion0422 02:20, 8 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sources look good. Dabomb87 (talk) 22:53, 7 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Featured_list_candidates/List_of_Olympic_men%27s_ice_hockey_players_for_Canada/archive1&oldid=1143899141"