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Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Sonic Gems Collection/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was archived by Laser brain via FACBot (talk) 23:10, 18 June 2018 [1].

Sonic Gems Collection edit

Nominator(s): JOEBRO64 22:23, 17 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Not sure what to say about this one. The article is really nice and compact, and I think it really covers its subject well. For those who don't know about this: Sonic Gems Collection is a 2005 compilation of video games (mostly Sonic, but a few others) published by Sega for the PlayStation 2 (only in non-American regions, though) and GameCube. It got mixed reviews; although the inclusion of rarities like Sonic CD and Vectorman were universally praised by reviewers, opinions about the rest of the compilation were conflicting. I think it's a great read and am convinced meets the FA criteria. Enjoy! JOEBRO64 22:23, 17 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Squeamish Ossifrage edit

Starting with (and focusing on) sourcing, but I'll wander into other topics when I notice things. This shouldn't be considered a comprehensive prose review.

  • Including a publisher for web (and periodical) sources is optional (some people will argue that it's discouraged, especially for periodicals, but we allow editors a lot of mileage when defining their own house citation style). That said, optional referencing aspects are all-or-nothing, and you've got a mix of "publisher cited" and "publisher ignored", which isn't okay. Furthermore, there's an argument to be made that you don't always cite the publisher correctly. Let's look at reference 1, an article at IGN, with the publisher given as Ziff Davis. It is correct that Ziff Davis was the publisher/owner of IGN when you accessed that source in 2018 (and when it was archived in 2016). But I'm not sure it's correct to say that Ziff Davis published that article, because IGN was owned by Imagine Media at the time that it was actually published.
    • I've removed them for the online sources. After I wrote this, I was told listing publishers for online references is incorrect usage as it's meant for books or non-italicized works. JOEBRO64 19:49, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • The GameZone article has a byline, albeit a pseudonymous one (kombo). I like to notate those with "[pseud.]" but consensus as I generally understand it is to cite bylined authors even when it's clear they're not writing under their legal name.
  • Is the best reference for the unlocked demos just to cite in-game content? Likewise, attributing "Sonic the Fighters is a proper port" to the game's credits? I'm not saying that there might not be caused to do so, but... Also, the two citation entries to in-game content are formatted somewhat differently.
    • The game is the best reference for the demos because they're not really mentioned in any reviews; just the game and its manuals. Sonic the Fighters info can be sourced to the credits because there is "console conversion" staff listed. As for formatting, I've turned them into a single reference, rather than two differently formatted ones. JOEBRO64 19:49, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • Unlike articles with pseudonymous bylines, precedent as generally been to simply omit the author for staff credits. I wouldn't ding someone who wants to cite "IGN staff" as the author, but you certainly can't pretend that's a first/last name by presenting it "Staff, IGN".
  • I have no idea what that Cube reference is. I assume it's the defunct GameCube-specialist magazine with that title, but that means the citation is badly incomplete.
    • It's been like that for years, and while I've added the publisher I'm not sure which issue it was. The scan that exists doesn't provide a date or issue number so the only clue to when it was published is that both SADX and Sonic Mega Collection were just announced. As this happened in July 2002, I'm pretty sure this puts it at issue 8 or 9 but I could be wrong. I've asked for input at WT:VG. JOEBRO64 23:22, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • Why is Hardcore Gaming 101 a high-quality reliable source?
  • Your two Nintendo Power references are not formatted in quite the same way.
    • I hadn't realized it was the same issue. Fixed formatting. JOEBRO64 19:49, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • Do any sources address the Playstation 2 version separately (obviously, you'd be looking at sources outside the US here)?
    • I found one review of the PS2 version from Jeuxvideo.com, so I added that into the article. JOEBRO64 23:22, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • This got a first release in Japan; was there any coverage in the Japanese gaming media?
    • I found some Japanese coverage for the development and reception sections. I couldn't find any dedicated reviews, unfortunately. JOEBRO64 23:22, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • I know this got a review in Electronic Gaming Monthly. Did they say anything different from the other sources that might make that worth citing here?
    • There's a bit from it I've added to the article. JOEBRO64 23:22, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • FAC's most picky detail: when you use multiple citations to support a single sentence, those references should appear in numerical order (that is, [2][3] rather than [3][2]). You've got a few of these, but since there may be some work to do in the referencing in general, this is the sort of thing you clean up last.
    • I meant to do this... fixed now. JOEBRO64 23:32, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • Prose... needs work in places. From the lead: "Some reviewers were disappointed by the absence of the Streets of Rage titles in the North American version due to problems with the Entertainment Software Rating Board and other Sonic games like Knuckles' Chaotix and Sonic the Hedgehog Pocket Adventure." So... the absence of Streets of Rage' was due to problems with ... other Sonic games like Knuckles' Chaotix and Sonic the Hedgehog Pocket Adventure? This sentence doesn't say what you mean for it to say.
    • Fixed; removed the "due to problems with the Entertainment Software Rating Board" part. JOEBRO64 20:38, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • §Gameplay lists a bunch of platforms this inherited from, then mostly fails to connect those to the list of games, sometimes in confusing ways. "The Japanese version also features four other Genesis games by Sega...", but "other" is awkward here, as none of the previously mentioned games were identified as originating on the Genesis.
    • I've connected them by mentioning the platforms along with the respective games. JOEBRO64 20:38, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • ...and, actually, I'm concerned that the approach to the regional variants presents US-centrism. This game was first released in Japan, so there's a strong argument to be made that the article shouldn't present the JP/EU version as having additional games, but rather describe that as the baseline, with the US version lacking some of the titles (indeed, that's pretty much how sources seem to describe the situation also).
    • I've presented the Japanese version as the base game now; I've mentioned them before stating they're exclusive to Japan. JOEBRO64 20:38, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • Why do you describe Sonic Spinball as "pinball-centric"? The source cited certainly doesn't use that phrase, and pretty much every reference to the game (on its own merits) that I can find simply calls it a pinball game.
    • Changed to "pinball game". JOEBRO64 20:38, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • "...the remaining six Game Gear games..." Consider a footnote identifying these?
    • Done. Not sure why I didn't do this before. JOEBRO64 20:38, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • "When a demo is selected, the player is given a time limit to finish the selected title's final level." This seems unclear to me. Does the demo include only the final level? Does it include the whole game, but there's a time limit? Does it include the whole game, but there's a time limit that applies only to the final level?
    • The "demo" starts by putting you in the final level of the respective game. If you complete the level, you can keep playing the game until time is up. I've hopefully clarified this. JOEBRO64 20:38, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

- Squeamish Ossifrage (talk) 17:29, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@Squeamish Ossifrage: Thank you for reviewing! I've responded to your points above. JOEBRO64 23:32, 18 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Quick follow-ups: As the footnote is not a complete sentence, it doesn't need a period. That said, I think this is much improved. I wish there was an independent source for the "proper port" claim, rather than just the "Console conversion" team in the credits. I don't have access to this book; do you have any idea if it has any relevant content? Finally, much as I hate to draw lines, I'll note that I really cannot support FA promotion while the Cube reference lacks sufficient bibliographical information. You'll either need to figure out an issue/date on that, or else re-source what it's supporting, I suspect. Squeamish Ossifrage (talk) 17:40, 23 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
@Squeamish Ossifrage: Thanks for following up! I've removed period in the note and the Cube reference, which I replaced it with other reliable sources. Unfortunately The History of Sonic the Hedgehog's doesn't have anything to add to this article; just passing mentions about how a game was in it. JOEBRO64 22:42, 23 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@FAC coordinators: I don't mind if you go ahead and close this. It looks like this is unlikely to garner any more comments (considering how long it's been open for) and I'm currently prepping another article (The Death of Superman) for FAC, which I'd rather have open than this one. JOEBRO64 19:09, 13 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@TheJoebro64: Please note that the two-week waiting period before nominating another article applies here. --Laser brain (talk) 23:10, 18 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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