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Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Interstate 80 Business (West Wendover, Nevada – Wendover, Utah)/archive1

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The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by SandyGeorgia 00:24, 17 January 2011 [1].

Interstate 80 Business (West Wendover, Nevada – Wendover, Utah) edit

Interstate 80 Business (West Wendover, Nevada – Wendover, Utah) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

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Nominator(s): Admrboltz (talk) 00:01, 27 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I am nominating this for featured article because I feel that this article meets the requirements. The highway has historical significance, and is the main street between the twinned cities on the Nevada–Utah border. The article has previously passed GAC and project ACR, and has been copy edited by the WP:GoCE. Admrboltz (talk) 00:01, 27 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

oppose File:Interstate_80_Business_(NV-UT)_map.svg lacks context for readers who are unfamiliar with the subnational geography of the USA Fasach Nua (talk) 18:01, 27 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

An updated version has been uploaded under the same file name that incorporates File:Map of USA UT.svg, with both Utah and Nevada highlighted in red. Please let me know if this will help for readers unfamiliar with the subnational geography of the USA to understand the map. --Admrboltz (talk) 18:59, 27 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
We are going in the right direction, however the caption needs updated to explain all elements of the image Fasach Nua (talk) 19:23, 27 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
|map_notes= has been updated in {{Infobox road}}, and the description on File:Interstate 80 Business (NV-UT) map.svg has been updated as well. --Admrboltz (talk) 19:30, 27 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
WP:FA Criteria 3 Met Fasach Nua (talk) 19:42, 27 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Why is a short stretch of a subsidiary road notable?
    • The highway was part of the Victory Highway and U.S. Route 40, both significant highways in the history of the US, and serves as the main road between a pair of twinned cities who have such stark differences. W Wendover has tax revenue and casinos, allowing them to have nice new govt facilities, schools, etc, where as Wendover is just a little blip, no tax base at all, and almost a 180 from the NV side, and this road links the two. And obviously someone thought it was important enough to put a gas station on the highway, and now that station is a casino, and still an important stop as there is no (reliable) gas over the salt flats. --Admrboltz (talk) 17:49, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • What's a "sky bridge" as opposed to a "bridge"?
  • if you are using line, I'd prefer "marks" to delineates in the state border sentence
  • Twenty-one percent of this traffic consists of truck traffic. — repetition of "traffic"
  • This is expressed in terms of average annual daily traffic (AADT), which is a measure of traffic volume for any average day of the year. — What's an average day? I can see what's meant here, but could be better expressed
    • Well its just that, an average day the AADT article explains it better, but I can try to rephrase if you want me to. --Admrboltz (talk) 17:43, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
      • shouldn't it be which is a measure of average traffic volume for any (each?) day of the year.? Jimfbleak - talk to me? 19:34, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • desolate desert — don't these words mean the same thing?
  • ''partial diamond interchange — which means?
  • Two other roads have been numbered Utah SR-58 in the past. — although the routes are concurrent for part of the way, the article is not about SR-58, so it's not clear why this para is in an article about I-80
    • Its because UT-58 redirects to this article, and there has to be some mention of these highways in the article since BL-80 has replaced the UT-58 article. --Admrboltz (talk) 17:43, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
      • I'm not sure that's a totally convincing argument, why can't UT-58 have its own stub? Jimfbleak - talk to me? 19:34, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
        • The article should not exist in my opinion. The article would either a) have very little contest and refer to BL-80, or duplicate all of the information in this article. --Admrboltz (talk) 21:06, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comments - I have a few concerns with this article before I can support it for FA:
  1. Can a creation date for NV 224 be found?
    I emailed the public works officer of West Wendover, but have yet to receive a reply. --Admrboltz (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    I emailed the Nevada Department of Transportation this morning to see if they can assist. --Admrboltz (talk) 15:54, 29 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    The creation date of SR 224 is likely to be July 1, 1976, which is the authorization date of most current Nevada highways and is coincident with the statewide renumbering of all of Nevada's highways. SR 224 was removed from state maintenance prior to publication of any of the state highway log files I have, so I cannot verify this with a source at present--I may be able to find a source for this with a trip to the UNR library in a few days. -- LJ ↗ 09:57, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    If you can do that for me, that would be excellent. --Admrboltz (talk) 17:43, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    I have confirmed the "Approval Date" of July 1, 1976 for SR 224--see the thread on my talk page. -- LJ ↗ 05:47, 7 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
    Thank you! --Admrboltz (talk) 06:05, 7 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  2. Can a mention be made in the history that the route was signed sometime in the 1980s?
    Seems WP:ORish, I know that its signed now but I can't cite that there were signs up in the 80s, only that the application for the designation was deferred in the 80s, and its now signed. --Admrboltz (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Are there any maps that you can find showing BL 80? Dough4872 18:22, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    The loop is too close to mainline I-80 to show on a state-wide map. --Admrboltz (talk) 18:31, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Are there any more localized maps from the 1980s that can be found to verify the creation of the route? Dough4872 18:36, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Not that I am finding, but I will keep looking. W Wendover wasn't even a city till 91, so the chances are low of finding a detailed enough map for the area. --Admrboltz (talk) 21:02, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    I emailed the Nevada Department of Transportation this morning to see if they can assist. --Admrboltz (talk) 15:54, 29 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    NDOT maps typically do not show city-level detail for most municipalities in Nevada. NDOT does publish some city-level detail maps on their website, but these maps tend to show the overlapping state route and not the business loop shields. NDOT's route logs do not reflect business loops in any fashion, so field signage is often the only way to verify that the business loops exist. -- LJ ↗ 09:57, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Thats what I was finding as well. The latest version NDOT put out was in 93 when 224 was still listed on the map. And yeah, I can't seem to find older SMs on the NDOT site. --Admrboltz (talk) 17:43, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  3. The history section of the article seems a little disorganized. The second paragraph should be moved to the end of the history section as it deals with recent events.
    This has been mentioned earlier, and I have received conflicting suggestions. Some say to keep the US 40 stuff together, some say keep it chronological. Originally I had the Victory Highway stuff at the bottom, but was told to move it up to where it is now. --Admrboltz (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    I would prefer for the history to read chronologically. Dough4872 18:22, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Moved. --Admrboltz (talk) 18:31, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  4. Can the state line row in the Major intersections table be formatted similar to the one in U.S. Route 113? Dough4872 18:03, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    I would prefer not to, as I need the notes column for the concurrency note. --Admrboltz (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Another viable option would be to format the table in a similar matter to the one in Pennsylvania Route 491. Dough4872 18:22, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Personally I think that looks even more confusing / cluttered than what is in the article now. --Admrboltz (talk) 18:31, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    The only concern I have with the current table is the blank entry for the junction column. Dough4872 18:36, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Tweaked. --Admrboltz (talk) 18:56, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    I would suggest not having the Nevada columus come down all the way for the state line row. In PA 491, the state line row is split between PA and DE. See that article for how it should appear here. Dough4872 18:59, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Imzadi1979 (talk · contribs) made the change. --Admrboltz (talk) 21:02, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  5. I also have two concerns with the sentence "Formerly BL-80 was the only connection to Wendover from Utah, but the Utah Department of Transportation (UDOT) completed a new partial diamond interchange at Aria Boulevard, which allows traffic from I-80 to exit going westbound and for traffic to enter I-80 eastbound." I do not think the Google Maps reference supports the statement. In addition, can an opening date for this interchange be found? Dough4872 18:40, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Some details added. I use to have a document with an opening date, but UDOT has completely redesigned their website, and I cant find it right now. --Admrboltz (talk) 21:02, 28 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Opening date added for Aria Blvd. --Admrboltz (talk) 04:39, 29 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    I emailed the Utah Department of Transportation this morning to see if they can assist with a more precise opening date / better source. --Admrboltz (talk) 15:54, 29 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    Support - My issues have been addressed. Dough4872 06:09, 7 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Sources comments: Although maps are widely used as sources in road articles, it is important that the facts cited to them are verifiable. I have had some difficulties in this respect, for example:-

  • Ref 1: The map is apparently being used to verify mileages, but I can't see where the mileages are given in the map
    If you pull the map the mileages are listed in small print next to the roadway. The first mileage is from the "West Wendover Interchange" marked 93A, the western portion of BL-80: 0.12. Then the road turns right next to the welcome center, 0.16. Then the final portion marked 224 is 0.62. Add these up and you get the total mileage of BL-80 in NV as 0.9 mi (1.4 km) which I had off, and corrected in the Road Junction List. The infobox showed the correct length. --Admrboltz (talk) 02:25, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • The following statements are cited to the map in ref 4: "Traveling east along Wendover Boulevard, BL-80 passes by the Peppermill casino, the West Wendover Visitors Center and Scobie Park. US 93 Alt turns south towards Ely, while BL-80 continues east until it reaches the Montego Bay Resort and Wendover Nugget casinos. The casinos are connected via a sky bridge that allows pedestrian access between the hotels without crossing the highway." How is this information veified by the map?
    • Moved ref four to cite the other two casinos, and added the 1993 city map to cite Scobie Park. --Admrboltz (talk) 02:35, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    • I also added a Google Street View lins dead tree reference for the skybridge. --Admrboltz (talk) 02:39, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
  • I had similar problems verifying information cited to 7, 8 and 20
    • Ref 7 is the Shafter Subdivision cite. If you click on "Sample page: UP Shafter Subdivision (West half)" it will show you this line (Shafter Subdivision) passing through Wendover. --Admrboltz (talk) 02:35, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    • Ref 8 is the UPRR Common Line name map, which if you follow the green line through to the number 13 will show you this line as part of the UPRR Central Corridor. --Admrboltz (talk) 02:35, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
    • Ref 20 is the 1976–1977 Nevada DOT map, in section B6 shows the interstate grade (green line) Alt-50 line connecting in from Utah no longer carrying the US 40 designation, and further up the highway west of West Wendover, showing a I-80 shield. --Admrboltz (talk) 02:35, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I was unable to download the map in 17. The map in refs 22, 23 and 24 is one and the same, so perhaps these three refs could be combined. Brianboulton (talk) 22:18, 30 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Ref 17 is a linked image from commons. The file name is File:1926us.jpg. Refs 22-24 are in fact all Nevada Highway Maps, but if you look at the |year= field on {{cite map}} they are three different years: 1953, 1954, and 1978–1979. --Admrboltz (talk) 02:15, 31 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]
You have obviously moved to address my concerns. My problem is that I barely understand a word of your explanations. Is "pull the map" an Americanism for "enlarge the map"? Can you explain a little more clearly how you have addressed my concern re ref 4? What is a "dead tree reference"? Brianboulton (talk) 17:30, 6 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I will attempt to be clearer. Pull the map - Yes, if you open the map and zoom in on it, you should see the small numbers next to the line that indicate the mileage.
"Traveling east along Wendover Boulevard, BL-80 passes by the Peppermill casino, the West Wendover Visitors Center" -- verified by ref 4 "...and Scobie Park." -- verified by the 1993 city map. "US 93 Alt turns south towards Ely, while BL-80 continues east until it reaches the Montego Bay Resort and Wendover Nugget casinos." -- verified by ref 4. "The casinos are connected via a sky bridge that allows pedestrian access between the hotels without crossing the highway." -- verified by the new book reference.
I hope this helps. --Admrboltz (talk) 17:49, 6 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, things are a little clearer. If no other reviewer raises the points which I have left unstruck, you may consider them resolved. Brianboulton (talk) 23:21, 16 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Comments I have a number of suggestions to improve how this article reads. –Fredddie™ 03:54, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

  1. This is more of a personal preference than anything, but unless you're writing a letter, you should not use postal abbreviations.
    done --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  2. Is there any part of SR-58 that is not part of BL-80? If there is not, that is, if SR-58 and BL-80 are one and the same, a better word than concurrent is coterminous.
    There is not, wording changed. --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  3. The last sentence of the lead should read "Between July 1976 and 1993, BL-80 was concurrent with State Route 224 in Nevada."
    done --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  4. SR-58 is nearly always abbreviated while SR-224 never is.
    Corrected. --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  5. {{Jct}} uses a period in the abbreviation for alternate ( US 93 Alt.), while there are no such periods in the prose. These should be consistent.
    Corrected. --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  6. What kind of line is painted across the street at the state line?
    See Flickr image. --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  7. You mention Utah DOT's abbreviation, twice actually (you should use the abbreviation the second time), but never mention Nevada DOT's abbreviation.
    Corrected. --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  8. The sentence where you mention where the highway is codified in Utah law seems tacked on after the fact.
    Well it kind of was. I couldn't really think of a better spot for it, and Imzadi1979 (talk · contribs) mentioned it should be mentioned in prose since it was in the infobox. Do you have a suggestion where I should put it, or should I just drop it? --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  9. The second sentence in the history section should read "To welcome travelers to his station, he installed a light bulb at the top of a tall pole, which served as the only light in the desert.[15]"
    done --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  10. "Wendover Boulevard was formerly numbered US 40..." seems redundant. Maybe remove formerly?
    done --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  11. "Between 1932 and 1953,[22][23] the designation was US 50, and between 1954 and either 1978 and 1979,[24][25] the designation was US 50 Alt." Would it sound better if the designation was became it was designated?
    done --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  12. "Wendover Boulevard between US 93 Alt and the state line was formerly designated..." Same as 10.
    done
  13. "Even though BL-80 is signed in both Nevada and Utah, the route was never officially designated a business loop..." and "No such request was ever submitted.[29]" Maybe change was (n)ever to has (n)ever been. The changes will make it sound like it could one day become an official business loop.
    done --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  14. "Formerly, BL-80 was the only connection to Wendover from Utah, but..." From here to the end of the section should be rewritten for clarity. I wouldn't use formerly in this instance. We know the interchange opened in 2007, so I would start it with "Prior to 2007, BL-80..."
    done --Admrboltz (talk) 07:01, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support. My concerns have been addressed. –Fredddie™ 07:23, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support I've been watching the discussions above, and I feel that this article meets all of the criteria for Featured Articles at this time. Imzadi 1979 → 16:40, 8 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Query, could someone please educate me as to why we need this big long convoluted article name? It makes no sense to me, and with this sort of naming convention, article titles can go on indefinitely. What is the reason the article can't be named "Interstate 80 Business (BL-80)"? SandyGeorgia (Talk) 22:21, 12 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
    • There are 11 separate business routes of Interstate 80 in California and Nevada alone, all requiring geographic disambiguation. Unlike Interstate 80 Business (Sacramento, California), this route crosses a state line meaning we have both cities' and states' names in use. Imzadi 1979 → 22:49, 12 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
      • If anything, this article could be renamed Interstate 80 Business (Nevada–Utah) since it's the only business route that is in both states, but I could see how that could be misleading. –Fredddie™ 22:55, 12 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
      • This was so named because of WP:USSH, the US State Highways Naming Convention. --Admrboltz (talk) 06:46, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Do we need this level of precision in decimal places? Seems like unnecessary burden to the reader-- at your discretion.
  • ... Utah State Route 58 for the final 1.363 mi (2.194 km) through Wendover, Utah ...
  • This sentence has been reworded. --Admrboltz (talk) 06:46, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • External jump in the text, that's a no-no ... external links belong in EL or as citations, not in text:
  • The Utah segment of BL-80 is codified into Utah law as Utah Code §72-4-111.

SandyGeorgia (Talk) 03:39, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Re the external link. This in invoked by the infobox template. It was a result of ambiguity in the state of Utah's copyright policy. For other states, such as California, the state laws have been uploaded to wikisource, and the infobox would include a transwiki link to the copy of state law on wikisource. However, in the case of Utah, the terms of use on the legislature's homepage are ambiguous about if the state law can be considered public domain, the website does state that Utah code is free for non-commercial use. However, wikipedia does not consider that to be free use. As such linking directly to the legislature's website was determined to be the best solution until we get clarification. Dave (talk) 06:23, 13 January 2011 (UTC) I was just informed that your comments were referring to a different EL which was removed before I read this. Dave (talk) 06:33, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
This has already been removed by another editor. --Admrboltz (talk) 06:46, 13 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment - There's a couple different ways to read "Nevada DOT applied for the designation, but it was deferred in July 1982 until Utah submitted a request for a business loop. No such request has ever been submitted.[29]" - please make more clear. --Rschen7754 22:09, 16 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
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