User talk:DanTD/Archive. March 2012

Better Edit Notice

Is there a way that, when someone (say, you, for instance) is editing a page (say, Florida State Road 55, for instance), and someone else (say, me, for instance) clicks an edit link on the said page, that the "someone else" gets a block page (i.e. they aren't allowed to edit at all!). Ask me to explain further, if you don't understand. Allen (talk) 22:18, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

Short answer: no. Imzadi 1979 → 23:10, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

If someone is editing a page, and someone else tries to edit it while they are still in the page, then the 2nd person should get totally blocked. Also, if someone is editing a page, no other person should be able to edit the page until after the 1st user finishes their edits. Allen (talk) 23:12, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

If you're saying only one person should be allowed to edit Wikipedia pages, you don't know how Wikipedia works. ----DanTD (talk) 23:18, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

What I meant is this: If one person is editing a page, no other person should be able to edit it until the first person has finished. What if the first person is making a major edit? Then, they have to attempt to incorporate the other edits into their own (not an easy thing, mind you!). How do people do that? Allen (talk) 23:30, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for March 11

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Fixed. Now I just have to work on the last two counties in there. ----DanTD (talk) 12:51, 11 March 2012 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for March 18

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County road markers

Category:Jct template transclusions with missing shields is full of articles of your creation. FHWA recently redid the CR marker design to change the presentation of the yellow border. In reacting to this change, we discussed creating generic markers that could work for multiple states at once. As a result, TMF has created new generic CR markers that don't contain the county name since it's not legible when displayed at 20 pixels by {{jct}}. By dropping a county name that can't be read, we don't need multiple versions of markers that differ only by an illegible detail. The full set 1–999 isn't done yet, but I have switched jct over to use the new markers for Florida.

It would be a welcome gesture of goodwill if you could help clear this backlog by compiling a list of the less common numbers that don't have markers. The various missing suffixed or "oddball" numbers that aren't in commons:Category:Diagrams of generic county route markers. That way, if the list isn't daunting, we can clear that category before long. I would suggest that you suspend the creation of additional CR lists to clear up the backlog created by the existing ones. Remember, the project priority is on state highways first, county road last. Imzadi 1979 → 07:30, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

It would also help if I could get county road markers that do exist onto those junctions. U.S. Route 19 Alternate (St. Petersburg – Holiday, Florida) is one article that really shouldn't be in this category, because as you can see on the List of county roads in Pinellas County, Florida, shields exist for all four county roads that are putting that article in the category. I will keep your suggestion in mind, though. ----DanTD (talk) 13:30, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Holy crap! The List of county roads in Hillsborough County, Florida, actually had a complete list of CR shields, but now they're gone! ----DanTD (talk) 13:49, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Are you saying you just want a generic list of what's needed or something county-specific? Either way, I'm afraid I may miss something, but I'll do it. ----DanTD (talk) 14:26, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

I'm saying that {{jct}} will no longer use county-specific markers. The 2012 supplement to the 2004 edition of the Standard Highway Signs, which is a companion to the Manual of Uniform Traffic Control Devices, has changed how county road markers are designed. Since we now need to update how our graphics look (just like when South Carolina updated its state highway markers), we have implemented a generic set of markers. At the size displayed by {{jct}}, you can't read the county name meaning it's not really needed in junction lists or tables. The only place where a county-specific marker would be needed is in an infobox.

Now, as for Pinellas County, all of those graphics will have to change because they're the old style, not the new style. In addition, the graphics shouldn't be larger than 20px and they shouldn't be in a separate column. We're not going to make county-specific graphics for county roads using the new style marker unless they are needed for an infobox, and then we will be scrutinizing if that use is really needed. Your assistance in figuring out what graphics are missing is needed. TMF is making graphics for 1-999 as well as the suffixed numbers needed for New York. Your task is to make a list of the suffixed numbers and other oddball cases for Florida. The sooner the list is compiled, the sooner we can create them. Imzadi 1979 → 20:27, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Okay, so generic it is then. Since you mentioned New York, it'd be nice if you had some Orange County-specific ones. ----DanTD (talk) 21:41, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Here's my list, and it's not complete;

A1A, 5A, 13B, 15A, 15B, 15C, 16A, 16B, 17A, 17B, 20A, 20B, 21A, 21B, 21C, 21D, 25A, 25B, 29A, 37A, 37B, 44, 44A, 44B, 44C, 44W, 46A, 57A, 63A, 64, 64A, 64B, 68A, 77A, 78, 78A, 78B, 95A, 100A, 100B, 100A1, 101A, 105, 105A, 115A, 115B, 115C, 121A, 200A, 200B, 210A, 224, 224A, 225A, 229A, 230A, 270, 270A, 276A, 284A, 318, 326, 328, 427A, 436A, 437A, 438A, 439, 441, 468, 469, 470, 475, 475A, 475B, 475C, 476, 476A, 476B, 478, 478A, 480, 484, 485, 486, 490, 490A, 491, 495, 500, 500A, 500B, 522, 523, 523A, 524, 525, 525A, 526, 526A, 527, 527A, 528, 530, 530A, 531, 531A, 532, 535, 540, 540A, 541, 542, 542A, 544, 544A, 545, 546, 546A, 547, 550, 555, 557, 557A, 559, 559A, 567, 587, 587A, 595, 595A, 599, 600, 603, 605, 606, 609, 609A, 610, 611, 613, 615, 619, 620, 621, 622, 623, 627, 630, 630A, 634, 634A, 635, 653, 655, 655A, 664, 673, 700, 700A, 700B, 704A, 707, 708, 709, 710, 711, 713, 714, 718, 720, 721, 721A, 723, 724, 731, 732, 733, 750, 762, 765, 768, 769, 771, 777, 779, 798, 803, 809, 809A, 810, 833, 840, 850, 858, 865, 876, 884, 886, 896, 905, 912, 930, 939, 939A, 940, 951, 996, 1424, 1555, 2209, 4009, 4019, 4040, 4050, 4116, 4118, 4137, 4146, 4162, 4164, 7006, 7010

I've know I've skipped over a few, and I might've requested some you've already got. I'll have to add them later, especially since there's still a limit to how many can be requested in the Shields task force/Requests project. ----DanTD (talk) 01:39, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

Infobox road small

Just something else to keep in mind, but {{infobox road small}} has a color bar under the marker and road name that uses the same color coding scheme as {{infobox road}}. Please use code like:

|state=FL
|type=CR
|route=64A
|county=Hardee

in your infobox coding. That will do two things. 1) It will set the bar to the green color used in the US instead of the blue color used in the other countries as a default. 2) It will automatically generate the name and marker as needed; if the marker is missing, you won't get the ugly bold redlinks. Imzadi 1979 → 20:43, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Junction list templates

I would suggest that going forward, you use the junction list templates to make the tables. {{FLint}} is a Florida-specific version of {{jctint}}, and there are the bridge/place/restarea templates (really all the same one with different names) and such. The reason I suggest that you do this is simple. At some point in the coming weeks, we will be updating the templates to create two distance columns. If you input the mileposts as miles, the template will convert each number to display the metric equivalent. This is something that has been requested more than a year ago, and the templates have been updated to allow for the change whenever we activate it. If you have an intersection or a bridge with a range of MPs, please use |mile= |mile2= so that the templates can individually convert the two separate numbers.

Beyond that change, the template that generates the top row, {{jcttop}}, contains hidden code for accessibility reasons. That code tells a screen reader program used by the blind what parts of the table are columns so that the program can read the column names while reading the table. Something like: "County Miami-Dade Location Miami Mile 0.00 Destination US 41 Notes southern terminus" or whatever. As standards for accessibility change and update, we can update the templates, which in turn will update every article at once. Hand-coded tables are fine, but we'd have to update over 10,000 articles each time the standards change instead of one set of templates. Imzadi 1979 → 20:55, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Oh, I forgot another pair of advantage to the templates. They keep the milepost numbers right aligned. As long as you're using consistent numbers of decimal places, which should be the norm, the decimal points will roughly line up. That makes the tables easier to read. In the future, if we have to update MOS:RJL for some reason (say the milepost column has to go on the far left before the county column or something), we can update the templates once and all of the articles using them will instantly comply with the new format. I converted one county and the one bridge in U.S. Route 441 in Florida as a sample for you. When you finish the conversion at some point, please note that you can't use {{jct}} in the notes column of a table; MOS:RJL says that you can't have graphics in the notes column, only the destinations column. Imzadi 1979 → 21:05, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Shopping for Editors

Hello DanTD. I published Princess Theatre (Edmonton) a few days ago and I believe it falls into the scope of WikiProject Historic sites. The building is a Provincial Historic Resource in the province of Alberta. Seeing as you list yourself as being willing to take on the occasional Canadian sites, I was hoping you would be willing to add the Princess to the wikiproject, rate it, and perhaps take on its GA nomination. Thanks for your time! --Rawlangs (talk) 16:38, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

County route shields

Please stop "fixing" infoboxes; the route markers are in the process of being migrated to the new naming convention and will appear automatically once they're moved. Thanks. – TMF 20:35, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

Really? They weren't appearing so far. Okay, I'll stop for now, and wait for the renamed versions to turn up. ----DanTD (talk) 20:41, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

If you notice something broken with templates in general, please ask in the appropriate places. "Hard-coding" temporary fixes only just makes a huge mess that someone has to clean up later. --Rschen7754 public (talk) 21:26, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

Once the files have been created/moved as needed, the templates catch up for get updated, we'll have to revert everything you've done to hard code the marker display. Please, let the work progress and stop impeding it. Going forward, please use the templates because as they are updated, hundreds of articles automatically update themselves. Half of the hard-coding uses graphics at non-standard sizes (jct uses 20px in height, infobox road uses 70px in height and infobox road small uses 40px in height) and may or may not correctly unlink or bypass/create alternate text as needed per WP:ALT. Imzadi 1979 → 01:54, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Imzadi1979, my only problems with your edits, are that you removed everything else that was perfectly legitimate. I have no objection with the template updates, but in the process of reverting my attempts to add the shields, you also got rid of street names and other details on the List of county roads in Lake County, Florida, the state-specific US 441 links in Florida State Road 24, and in the case of Florida State Road 50, the version by the anonymous IP had damaged one of the images, and created excessive amounts of unnecessary space. ----DanTD (talk) 02:05, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

When I'm rolling back dozens of edits that only served to override the template, you'll get some unintended stuff. Guess what: you shouldn't have been overriding the infobox templates in the first place. Once the graphics are all recreated or moved to a consistent naming scheme, the old names you were using won't work! Imzadi 1979 → 03:03, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

But you do realize I was only trying to undo the unintended stuff, and I agreed to let you and the other administrators work on the updated shields and templates, right? Street names, locations, notes, and corrected images, can't possibly be that disruptive to the process. ----DanTD (talk) 03:26, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

When you're rolling back edits, it goes undoes everything by that editor, not the last edit. You did so many "revivals" that should not have been done that I just started rolling back every edit related to that (since it's once click, not two) for the dozens of edits. In the future, you should ask when templates (like infoboxes) start changing to see if the template is undergoing some temporary work that will be updated. Imzadi 1979 → 05:23, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Article help

Hello, would you mind lending a hand at List of county routes in Monmouth County, New Jersey (31-57) as well as the other related pages. There are several missing tables and empty sections. Thanks a lot. Tinton5 (talk) 22:39, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

I do but it is incomplete. Tinton5 (talk) 02:42, 27 March 2012 (UTC)