Talk:Rammstein/Archive 1

Band formation

I'm not sure where whoever wrote 1993 got it from, but I changed it to 1994 - Source http://www.rammstein.com/Band/Timeline/T1994/ /Hugoflug 23:40, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

U.S. Rosenrot Release Date

I have not read any information stating that Rosenrot will not be released in the U.S., only that no U.S. or Japan release dates have been announced. Does anyone have a reference that says otherwise? --mdd4696 00:34, 27 October 2005 (UTC)

No. But I still am really freakin' mad that it's NOT going to ever be released in the U.S. I would like to know why, but since I'm going to order an import from amazon.com, (Maybe what dude above should do.) It doesn't matter.

It is likely that the U.S. will have a release date very close to Canada's... don't give up yet! --mdd4696 21:16, 8 November 2005 (UTC)

they're not releasing in the US for awhile. u can order it online though or buy it as an import. i bought mine at Virgin in NYC. --msh25 03:54, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

I read on a fansite (www.rammsteinniccage.com) that Universal will be releasing it around the 28th of March. --stolilv87 01:07, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Olliver said: "We don´t want to release in the US something in the following time. We´re messed up of the USA" --[User:Rosenrotes Benzin|rosenrotesbenzin]] 22:53, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

Rammimages.com

I do not see the relevance to the Rammimages.com reference. It was all but a silly mis-understanding by both the webteam of the site and Rammstein Management. The whole thing got taken out of proportion, the webteam over-reacted an thus so did the fans. The whole thing was so childish, i see no reason why it be mentioned here.

In my opinion people, the Rammstein fans have no respect for Rammstein's intellectual rights, these things go on with all bands at a simular status as Rammstein - no-one complains. It's not uncommon. Appreciate that part of management's job is to look after and protect Rammstein. They are after all at the end of the day a "business" if you will, that makes money. An if they feel you are trying to deprive them of that money, with illegal images/files etc then they have every right to challenge you about it.

Understand that, respect that. There's no need for fans to conduct themselves as they do, i was appauled by some of the fans behaviour over the matter. For something that could have quite easily been solved in 2 days or less if only they'd have only contacted Rammstein's lawyers first, discussed it with them and resolved the issues in a civilized manner.

How on earth do you expect a band to deal with you, help your aid if all their getting is 1,000's of emails from irate fans? How are they suppose to know who to respond to?

I'm sorry but if Rammstein were unwillingly to the resolve the issues then by all means start all those petitions, news bulletins etc etc. But it seems to me, they WERE willing to help the site as much as they could but couldn't thanks to the actions of some of the fans orchestrated by the owners of the site.

They was simply no need for them to be as melodramatic as they were over the situation.

An whilst i sympathize because i know only too well how agressive lawyers can sound (though it's mostly all threats and they have no real intention of going through with it. Simply put- it would cost Rammstein way too much money to send the owner of a fansite to court over a few pesky pictures. 90% of the time it's all but a scare-tactic as Emanuel Fialik pointed out himself last time, regarding Rammsteinfan.de) i think the owners should have taken a breath an thought over the whole thing a bit more rationally before relaying the details back to the fanbase on their website. -86.129.29.183

I suppose we could have a vote on whether or not to keep the Rammimages.com sub-section. All personal opinions on the matter, though, should be ignored when voting. The question is does it belong on here.

--Der Sporkmeister 04:42, 7 September 2005 (UTC)

Well exactly, the whole purpose of the wikipedia article is meant to be on Rammstein's career and their music. What they've done and what their famous for basically, how they become what they are today.

This place is meant to be an enclopedia an i'm sorry but in the real world if Rammstein were entered into a propper hardback music encyclopedia then such things would not be mentioned. Rammimages.com has nothing to do with the band. An therefore no purpose here. Rammstein's fame has nothing do with that fansite, whether it existed or whether it didn't Rammstein would still be what they are today. You cannont question that. It defeats the object of having such an article/entry in the first place.

--Lilijana

Imo, it should be removed. -KeyStorm 16:12, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

Asorted comments

My German friends glow red at the mention of this band, and hotly claim that Rammstein is not representive of the German music scene. :) -- Stephen Gilbert

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Too bad for the German music scene. ;-) --Pinkunicorn

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Is it true they are banned in the U.S.? Heard this from a friend. Love the music, don't have a clue what they're saying, be it left-wing, nazi, or talking about their love for pink bunny rabbits. Dze27

They're not banned in the US. The record store at my local mall has all their CDs. It's all on Amazon.com too. Don't know about radio, but haven't heard anything about it. -Anonymous fan

I've heard them on the radio. But only a few times and the first time I heard them on radio, they were playing an English version of Links zwo drei vier. -other anonymous fan

Also, somebody translated the lyrics and posted them [1].

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I heard that new album will be released in march 2004?! TASHA

I don't think we need a list of every song they've ever written. The songs on albums are listed in the article on that album. They are apparently in the studio so March 2004 seems unlikely. Secretlondon 15:35, Jan 16, 2004 (UTC)

Links 234 is just a video from Mutter - it wasn't released as a DVD as far as I know. The only release of videos was Lichtspeilhaus. Unless there was a DVD single? Secretlondon 23:13, 18 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Yes there was a DVD single [2] but it apparently wasn't released in the US. --Biekko 00:46, 19 Jul 2004 (UTC)

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Heavy metal??? Rammstein is industrial, right?

lol @Dze27: do you really believe, they would be allowed to perform in germany or release any cd if their songs contained nazi-stuff? i appears that many of you americans think that every german still has a picture of hitler in his living-room and hates jews?? surely not, there are a few nationalists here, but not more than in other countries.

I'm glad someone adressed that. Being an American I see a lot of the controversy being translated into "Naziism" which really makes me a little more unsettled than usual.Rammstein is an awesome band with honest lyrics. How you interperet them is entirely personal, but let it be known: They are'nt Nazis and they are'nt gay!(Who cares?) Long live Till Lindemann!

Actually I've been to Germany and I've seen Karl Marx pictures hanging in living rooms, damn commies. And why do so many american christian groups think there neo-nazi? Some of the last names of members include "Hirsch" and "Bernstein" it doesn't exactly take a genius to figure out they have Jewish relatives somewhere along the line.

How do you know? Those Names arent exactly Hebrew. ;) Any Sources saying that those Names are jew-only?

Find me a non-Jewish Bernstein, I dare you.

I only know one Bernstein - he's a Jew(don't mean the Rammstein-member, don't know about that). ;) I didn't mean, that those were no Jewish names. Just wanted sources that say that they are. How come? I mean, Jews with such names exist worldwide, don't they? Why do they have German names? O_o

"Some of the last names of members include "Hirsch" and "Bernstein" it doesn't exactly take a genius to figure out they have Jewish relatives somewhere along the line." There's no one in the band with such a name!

bernstein is the name of richard's jew wife, and hirsch it's paul's real name. some say flake wasn't in the wedding 'cause he's anti-semitic. whatever i don't know about till's 9lindemann, the same surname of the nazi bismarck's officer OHHHH) mom, maybe they lied about that to stop the nazi comments, and another thing, all in all he hates her. and don't forget there are self-hating jews around the world. i don't know if they're nazi, but nazis enjoy their music, go to their concerts and print their name on shirts with swastikas and they don't seem to care about it, i mean, they're not kurt cobain at all.

Meaning of "Reise, Reise"

From http://herzeleid.com/en/lyrics/reise_reise , which translates the phrase as "arise, arise":

Though written as a noun, "Reise" is obviously used as a verb in the song. The phrase "Reise, Reise" is used by seamen as a wake-up call and finds its roots in the Middle High German verb "risen", which meant "to rise" (to which it is obviously related as well). This verb has since died out in New High German, though the noun was retained and came to mean "journey" or "voyage". The verb "reisen" was rederived from the noun "Reise", but now means "to journey" or "to travel". It seems the old meaning has been preserved in this phrase in the seaman's language.

-- ChrisO 21:02, 31 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Thanks, ChrisO, but this has been already discussed in Talk:Reise, Reise (before Herzeleid.com published the lyrics and the translations). --KeyStorm 18:36, 2 Nov 2004 (UTC)

The article implies that the single "Mein Teil" topped the German charts, but it made only No 2. No Rammstein single has ever topped the German charts, although several have made No 2. --zoltz

Rammstein may sing in German and that does cause problems understanding them.However they are a brilliant band and they sure do appeal to my taste in music which consists of Judas Priest.Black Sabbath.Rush,Alice Cooper etc`etc`.The live performance is simply superb as "Live Aus Berlin" proves. I liked Clawfinger but Rammstein have taken me further and i am addicted to Rammstein now.

Lazy journalist copies and pastes this article

Compare today's Manchester Evening News article on Rammstein [3] and the "Controversies" section of the Wikipedia article... -- ChrisO 12:43, 4 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Rammstein lyrics

I think Rammstein have the best lyrics in the world. If you check pot herzeleid.com you will find many "interresting" lyrics. But it feels kinda strange because of the thing in columbine. I'm a Rammstein and Doom fan, and those guy's that went berserk were that too. But i wont go berserk on my school...

Columbine kids

Well, the kids who caused Columbine were teased and rejected and it was just too much and they snapped. Their killings could have been prevented if they got psychological attention. It was their parents and teachers fault for not addressing these problems they should have seen developing long before they snapped. I mean, I might have actually done something insane like that if I hadn't gotten psychological attention from being constantly teased when I was in elementary school and had not ever gotten it at any point after that. My favorite bands are also Rammstein, Marilyn Manson, and Slayer.

Just cause you play Doom and listen to Rammstein, Marilyn Manson etc. Does not mean you'll go postal, if that was true, everyone within 10 miles of my house would be dead.

Laibach

Any word about Laibach? --Yonkie 05:13, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

been to see them live in the UK and they were amazing. they are only trying to make a living, so i dont see why they cause so much controversy. most people cant understand them, so i dont see how and why there music causes so much controversy.

Article is bias

I'm tired of people thinking that industrial music is listened to by emotionally disturbed induviduals, neo-nazis, and school shooters.

Yeah, Rammstein does some real crazy stuff on stage. (Flame throwers are awesome!) While I'm not too keen about the rest of the stuff, come on. Their from Europe. Yeah they may do strage things back in the old world, but ostricizing them from our culture is wrong.

The same goes for the industry (RIAA) which hates industrial rock.

Some of the best bands orginate from Europe. Rammstien is one of them.

Stop the bias against industrial rock! Stop associating industrial rock with violent individuals.

I love this band and I do find it stupid to blame its music for various acts of violence. These US school shootings would have happened with or without Rammstein and I don't make to much of the fact that these guys had some Rammstein CDs. However, Rammstein is controversial, that is a fact. We are building an encyclopedia, encylopedias describe facts. => We need a section on the controversies and the current one does an excellent job in my mind describing them in a distanced and neutral manner. --Bjarki 11:02, 9 May 2005 (UTC)

Re: Article is bias.

I agree that people shouldn't associate industrial music with violent & emotionally disturbed people. The controversy section does seem a little bias. I don't think it is necesary for the bits about the school shooters being there, so I'm removing them. --Der Sporkmeister 22:31, 9 May 2005 (UTC)

Re: Re: Article is bias.

Actually I have changed my mind. When you think about it, the controversies surrounding Rammstein is an important part of their image & what has made them so well known. Plus, it is made clear on here that Rammstein doesn't support school shootings & other such violence, and having that there is useful. When the article begins to imply that Rammstein are evil, support violence, etc., it has truly become bias. --Der Sporkmeister 22:37, 9 May 2005 (UTC)

Re: Re: Re: Article is bias.

Agreed. When you think about it, Germany has only had 1 incident since 1997 compared to the 30 or more incidents that have occured here in the United States, yet at the same time there have been more successful industrial bands from Germany than there have been from the United States, most of whom we have never heard of thanks to the suppressive tactics of the American recording industry and the damages cased by Tipper Gore and Lynn Cheney.

Not to be off topic but I was discussing with someone the other day about another genre. He brough up that rap music today is much worse than it was ten to fifteen years ago. Watching VH1 Classic one evening I saw that this guy was right.

People are so worried that music will corrupt us. The truth is it is not the music that corrupts us, it is the people who corrupt the music. Their "good deeds" were done in bad faith. --Bushido Hacks 05:54, 21 May 2005 (UTC)

Bück dich sub-subsection

This sub-subsection doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. I'm not a fan, just interested, and it seems that Bück dich is a song, but this is never stated in the section, only the story behind the english translation of the line... this sub-subsection should be fleshed out, i.e.:

Bück dich is a song by Ramstein that is about ... . The line Bück dich, dein Gesicht ist mir egal is from the Japanese Anime xyz, (short explanation), and they chose it for reason xyz. It is another example of Ramstein lyric style because of xyz.

Do you know what I mean?

On another note, I accept that Ramstein are Industrial/Metal, but they also seem to have some strong Goth influences, with all the choir music. JamesHoadley 10:53, 10 May 2005 (UTC)

Re: Bück dich sub-subsection

I'll fix that. --Der Sporkmeister 20:16, 14 May 2005 (UTC)

Reise, Reise

I know this has been mentioned before, but I thought I'd repost this for those who don't read older posts.

The album and song Reise, Reise means "Arise, Arise." Yes, reise can also be used as a noun to mean "journey", but this is not the case.

Though written as a noun, "Reise" is obviously used as a verb in the song. The phrase "Reise, Reise" is used by seamen as a wake-up call and finds its roots in the Middle High German verb "risen", which meant "to rise" (to which it is obviously related as well). This verb has since died out in New High German, though the noun was retained and came to mean "journey" or "voyage". The verb "reisen" was rederived from the noun "Reise", but now means "to journey" or "to travel". It seems the old meaning has been preserved in this phrase in the seaman's language. (Jeremy Williams. Herzeleid.com. http://www.herzeleid.com)

--Der Sporkmeister 16:50, 22 May 2005 (UTC)

Jewish mother?

Can somebody validate Till having a Jewish mother as fact for me? A link to a source would be good. --Der Sporkmeister 10:20, 26 May 2005 (UTC)

I'd suggest we take it out - I can't find any corroboration. However, Richard does have a Jewish wife according to the Washington Post (see [4]). -- ChrisO 11:22, 26 May 2005 (UTC)

Unless we can prove the factual accuracy of Till being half-Jewish, I fully support taking that bit out. I see no problem with adding the Jewish wife thing in. By the way, is that information already on Richard's page? --Der Sporkmeister 19:19, 26 May 2005 (UTC)

Is it even relevant? -- ChrisO 21:00, 26 May 2005 (UTC)

It's not the most important piece of information, but I don't see any problem with it being there. I am not going to add it, but if someboy else does, I won't object. --Der Sporkmeister 23:20, 26 May 2005 (UTC)

If there is no mention on them being Christian I see no point in adding such information, it's completely irrelevant unless that would have a meaning in his work, like, for example, if they were a Christian band.

They even sing, speaking about themselves, "Sie sind Gott -los" ("they are god -less"), so it would probably be more interesting to prove none of them is really interested in religion at all. KeyStorm 14:19, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)

How is the religion of a bandmember's mother relevant for this article? --Bjarki 17:38, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Well if she is Jewish, it destroys the common claims that Rammstein are Nazis. Other than that, it doesn't really serve any purpose. --Der Sporkmeister 17:43, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)

It doesn't matter anyway. We cannot verify his mother being Jewish as fact. --Der Sporkmeister 17:45, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Well why is it still there?

Here is a link for an explanation why they aren't nazis. Rammstein wrote the song "Links234" "in response to allegations of fascism/nazism directed at the band". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Links_2_3_4

Was Du Hast actually used in The Matrix?

I know it was on the soundtrack CD, but there was quite a lot of music on there that wasn't in the movie.

This happensa lot in movies: They use only an excerpt, usually an instrumental part, and then just include it into the OS. I don't remember where in the movie it was, but I'm almost sure of having heard it. Most probably it's the intro, it's been featured in a lot of TV spots. -KeyStorm 14:21, 17 Jun 2005 (UTC)

PS: Remember to sign your posts.

Good question. I don't recall ever hearing it, but it's been a long time since I last watched The Matrix and I didn't know who Rammstein is then. I'd like to know if it was actually used in the movie, too. --Der Sporkmeister 14:26, 17 Jun 2005 (UTC)

It was in the Matrix it was in the nightclub scene very early on in the movie, but as stated before it was only and instrumental part and could not have been played for more than 15 seconds.

Im pretty sure that part of a Rammstein song plays while the matrix program is scrolling.

It actually wasn't played in the movie at all I'm sure. The song in the club was Dragula by Rob Zombie. It has the same kinda guitar riff. :) b0red 20:56, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

I believe to remember that 2 songs are played in the club. Halfway through the scene (when it comes to talking, I think) the song changes. -- Genesis 16:14, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, I also think it was at the club. I'm pretty sure it in the movie. I have the DVD, so I can check it.

Mimbster 15:10, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

Heights

There exist no official height listings for any of the band members,Stop adding them. Whoever is adding them is getting them off of some free site that just added any height they thought the band was(and propbably misconverted cintimeter to feet at that).The heights are incorrect.

Users POV comments

ohne dich is one of the best songs of rammstein

Nonono! Its not. The best song is "Bück dich". Really hard riffs, thats how we all love Rammstein

The right translation of the Refrain of Reise Reise

You talk about the meaning of the song reise reise it doesnt mean arise (for me the word means for example the sun arise (if it has also got another meaning i don't know because i am fram germany)) it means to travel

now I translate the refrain

Ahoi

Reise, Reise Seemann Reise Jeder tut's auf seine Weise Der eine stößt den Speer zum Mann Der andere zum Fische dann

Ahoi

Travel, travel seaman travel Each does it in his own way One thrusts the spear to a man Another then to the fish

My dearest anonymous user: This has been longly discussed. And you being German does not mean you know what the phrase "Reise, reise, Seemann reise" means. It comes from old German and accurately means "Arise, arise, seaman arise"

My dearest whoever: I am German as well and 'Reise' does mean journey in New German. Rammstein uses new German in their lyrics, otherwise I wouldn't be able to understand them. I also looked it up in a Old-New German dictionary. Just believe me, Reise DOESN'T MEAN arise. It wouldn't make any sense. Arise means 'irrīsan' in Old German. Btw: 'risen' is not a German word, neither old, nor new German.

Dance metal

Dance metal? What is this nonsense? Industrial metal already incorporates elements from electronic music. Anyone agree?

Sure, Tanzmetal is their own description of the music so it should definately be mentioned although I'm not sure it is worth linking to. --Bjarki 13:07, 7 August 2005 (UTC)

Just do what I do - call them an Indancetrial metal band. --Lironos / 2LIRONOS7 23:02, 19 September 2005 (UTC)

Electronic music and dance music aren't the same thing. Industrial music is a genre of electronic music, and dance is a different genre of electronic music. Most Industrial bands, while by definition having electronic elements, don't have elements of dance music. --SwitChar 20:46, 17 January 2006

Stripped in English

• "With the exception of the song "Amerika", which uses some English words in the chorus, Rammstein's lyrics are entirely in German."

No, Stripped was in English. Then again they didn't write it. This should be changed to include Stripped or why it's not.

You are correct. Stripped was in English. Also, Flake Lorenz's cover of "Pet Cemetary" was in English, too. I'll make the edit, but why couldn't you do it yourself? --Der Sporkmeister 01:59, 26 September 2005 (UTC)

Just making sure I wasn't being a dumbass... I often make simple but profound mistakes, and I didn't want to put anything wrong. DevastatorIIC 05:42, 26 September 2005 (UTC)

and there is also an english version of america, engel, and of du hast (you hate)

pruzinki

what about the t.A.t.U. collaberation. i'm in the proccess of writing the track listings in the native russian and german of the 2 groups. I've also got some artwork. email me at theblindburito@gmail.com

This is great to know. Why don't you add your contributios to these pages yourself? It would be easier than passing over information from one end to the other. :) --KeyStorm 11:11, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

WikiProject?

Would anybody be interested in starting a Rammstein WikiProject? --Der Sporkmeister 22:02, 4 October 2005 (UTC)

Are there enough Rammstein related articles to justify a Rammstein WikiProject?

- Broodwich 5:18 PM, 26 October 2005 (UTC)

I've counted fifty-five. --Der Sporkmeister 18:24, 26 October 2005 (UTC)

And I count 72. I say go for it. -- SoothingR 11:01, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

I figured my count was wrong. I was in a rush when I counted that. Well, I just need a few people who are willing to join me. --Der Sporkmeister 14:34, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

I'd assist in that if I had anything worth saying to add, so my vote is also go for it. Tev 21:56, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

Check Rammstein.wikicities.com ;) It's already there!!!! [CHucky]

Song titled 'Te Quiero, Puta'

I have heard that the 'puta' in the title means 'bitch', but on this site it is translated as 'whore'. Can somebody who is schooled in spanish obscenities clarify this for me?

Although I'm not really "schooled in Spanish obscenities" (and never wish to be either), I can confirm that puta really does mean whore. -- SoothingR 14:00, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

Interglot gives a lot of results, 'bitch' and 'whore' included. [5] -- Jkruis 22:33, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

being spanish and german native speaker i definitely can prove the fact, that puta means whore. it is a whore not a slut nor bitch!--212.144.38.156 20:00, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

Puta literally translates as "whore", but can mean "bitch" as well. I would believe that it better translates to "bitch" in this context. Also, see the Spanish Profanity article. It states that "Puta, meaning 'whore,' implies the notion of 'bitch' in English." We should come to a consensus on this issue. I vote for "bitch". --mdd4696 21:46, 3 November 2005 (UTC)

Though I am not a native speaker of Spanish myself, I am friends with someone who is, and he has stated that were you to translate it into an English obscenity, it would be 'bitch', though the literal translation is whore. Tev 00:09, 8 November 2005 (UTC)

As possible dual meanings of words or expressions are typical for Rammstein lyrics, I think "whore" may be a better translation, as it may be used for both "prostitute" and "slut". Jkruis 08:49, 8 November 2005 (UTC)

I'm colombian, so I speak fluent spanish, and its curses. "Puta" means literally "prostitute", but as an offense, so "bitch" would be the best translation. "Whore" gets the idea, but isn't as strong

You need to look at the context of the song and also at the way Lindemann writes lyrics. I don't know which translation would be better suited from a dictionary point of view, but it would not be in Rammstein's character to insult someone with "bitch", whereas it would be to call them whore. Also, "puta" in this song is not even necessarily meant as an insult - this is Rammstein, after all. --NorkNork 13:16, 24 November 2005 (UTC)

-If you want to know why the translation is odd, look at the English words. Suppose you want an obscenity that is a 'bad word' for a female. You can think of several, and they all mean roughly the same thing. (To cut offensiveness a little, I'm being nice here) bit**, who**, cun*, slu*.... so when you're translating something like puta, you can basically put it as any of these, depending on the context. I love you, bit**! I love you, who**! I love you, cun*! I love you, slu*! These all basically mean the same thing: "I love you, woman of low moral standing!" gspawn 17:30, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

Is there anyone who would translate to English the lyric of "Te Quiero Puta"? I would be glad to read it while understanding it as well. --the_dragon 18:38, 13 January 2006(UTC)

Check BettInFlammen.com -> http://miarroba.com/foros/ver.php?foroid=861599&temaid=3841305 --CHucky 21:30 14 March 2006(UTC)

Translation of Rammstein

It appears that a user from 205.188.116.198 disputes the line "The extra 'm' in the band's name means that it translates literally as 'ramming stone', or 'battering ram'.". That user argues "Rammstein does not translate into 'Battering Ram', since the word 'Ramm' has no meaning whatsoever." Arguments like that are better suited for the talk page rather than the article text. Also, from the construction of a similar word it appears that the argument is incorrect. I've reverted for now; people with opinions should resolve it here before changing the text. --William Pietri 05:20, 8 November 2005 (UTC)

You're absolutely right. In German, there is no word 'Ramm'. However, they do say that they took their name from the town, 'Ramstein'. Which if you take the 'Ram' (Same meaning as in English) and the 'Stein' (Stone) you get 'Ramstone'. Now I wonder what that would be?...

-[personal story with parallels] My username on Wikipedia is calderra, taken from the word caldera, I added the extra letter so it would become a word that was unique for me. Plus, it steps slightly away from the fact that there's a massive caldera under Yellowstone national park that's caused extinction on a global level when it's erupted in the past. Like the word, don't like the association. I'm going to take a wild guess, and say this is basically the same thing that Rammstein did, as it takes a small step away from the actual accident at Ramstein, and does create that unique word for them. Lots of people do this sort of thing all the time. gspawn 17:29, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

My english is not the best but I´ve tried to translate the subsection of the german article relating the band name:

The name „Rammstein“ has its origin from the military airport in Ramstein (single m), Germany or more precisely, the airshow tragedy at Aug 28 th 1988. 67 people were killed that time. The band first denied this connection to the air crash and published that the name is related to a Rammstein, a stone of granite that is rammed into the ground to act as a bollard next to military installation entrances. Author Gert Hof discovered in his book “Rammstein” (ISBN: 3931126196) that the band´s original name was “Rammstein-Flugschau” (Rammstein airshow; double m) but only a few people could remember the full name so it shortened to “Rammstein”. (It has nothing to do with a battering ram.) --84.166.211.144 08:33, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

That's pretty good, but do you have sources on the band denying their connection to the accident? Because the song Rammstein is obviously about this accident. --NorkNork 09:00, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

No, I haven´t found any source in the german discussion of the article, I´ve just translated it. Sorry. --84.166.211.144 09:45, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

Individual articles for songs?

Which individual songs, if any, should have their own pages? Recently some articles such as Amerika (old_version) and Rammstein (old_version) have been redirected to their albums. Shawnc 07:54, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

Any song that is notable enough to have an article of its own can have one. "Du Hast", for example, is one of Rammstein's best-known songs. It is worthy of having an article of its own. --Der Sporkmeister 15:16, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

But what's the point in redirecting them to their albums? Jogers 20:43, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

Segway incident

The article currently lists two instances of the Segway HT incident (Flake hitting Lindemann), once for a July show in Sweden, once for a June show in an unnamed place. Aren't they actually the same incident? rWd 16:19, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

You are completely right. Fixed.

b0red 20:50, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Names at the top

Is there any reason for these, or am I just going insane? o.0 b0red 22:17, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Some issue with the template, I think I got it fixed. --Bjarki 22:53, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

Explanation of my Dec. 14 edits

• No need to link to "battering ram" from "ramming stone" as well, since it's already linked from "battering ram" itself.
• Spelling/grammar/style on the Grammy Awards line.
• Song and video titles (short works) in double quotation marks, not in italics. Album and VHS/DVD titles (long works) in italics without quotation marks. See Wikipedia:Manual of Style (titles). Quotes also in double quotation marks, except when mentioned on a line of their own.
• Removed duplicate links, so that any given link appears at most once per section, except in the movie appearances table.
• Rather than linking "Halleluja" to "Links 2 3 4", I'll create a redirect page titled "Halleluja".
• Capitalization in titles: all words. (Following the Wikipedia:Manual of Style (titles). I'm also fine with capitalizing only the first word, as long as the same scheme is used throughout the article.)
• "Links 2 3 4" is without commas, at least according to the Mutter album cover. It is given as "Links 2-3-4" on the single front cover, and again as "Links 2 3 4" on the back cover. So I guess we should use dashes or nothing, but at least no commas.
• The title of the single "Engel [Fan-Edition]" is given with brackets on its cover.

rWd 23:45, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the cleanup! ~MDD4696 (talk • contribs) 01:14, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

Capitalization rules in German are different than in English. I suggest using this scheme [6] (to capitalize only first worlds and nouns in German titles). Jogers 21:09, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

Example sound clip

Hi all. I've been thinking about creating a sound clip, per Wikipedia:WikiProject Composers, for this article. I would like to get some input on what people think is a typical song for Rammstein; one that would illustrate their style enough in a 30 second (or less) sound clip. I think the following songs show off the different elements mentioned in the Rammstein#Lyrics and style section of the article:

• Ich Will - Like many of Rammstein's song, it has a heavy beat. Till doesn't sing much, but he definately uses that signature deep voice. It's chorus is like many of Rammstein's songs; here it's a weird saw-like melody.
• Du Hast - A song many Americans are already familiar with. Edgy like some of their earlier music, but Till sings like he does in their newer albums. The keyboard and guitars are prominent.
• Zwitter - Has lots of funky sounds and an electronic metal sound. One of the weirder songs they've done.

We'd have to choose one of their longer songs since we can only make samples that are 30 seconds long, or 10% of the song, whichever is shorter. Well, leave your comments or suggestions! ~MDD4696 01:11, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

"Ich Will" is very powerful. "Du Hast" suffers from having been horribly mistranslated, and misunderstood. From the latest album, Rosenrot, "Feuer und Wasser" returns to earlier form- more old style Rammstein, and they would probably appreciate the joke (their pyromaniac obsession) or perhaps, even better, "Hilf Mir" (more pyromania with a good dollop of strange fairytale land and madness), it has a very familiar feeling to it, although I find it a very compelling Rammstein track. Chamonix 23:30, 7 January 2006 (UTC)[Chamonix, 7 Jan 2005]

I think the songs you suggested ("Hilf Mir" and "Feuer und Wasser") are good examples of their lyrical content, but I also think that they're too subdued to represent their musical style in general. ~MDD4696 05:40, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Well, I've added 4 sound clips that I think demonstrate several different aspects of Rammstein's style. Each clip is supported by some part of the Style or Lyrics sections. ~MDD4696 00:10, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Discography

In line with other music pages (I'm trolling through the heavy metal ones doing this), I've separated the discography off to a separate article. This prevents duplication on, for instance, band member articles and also reduces the size of the main page. If anyone fancies making it into a Wikitable and adding images of the album sleeves, be my guest! IainP (talk) 22:38, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Te Quiero Puta, English version?

Is there anyone who would translate to english the lyric of "Te Quiero Puta"? I would be glad to read it while understanding it as well. --the_dragon 18:38, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

See Herzeleid. ~MDD4696 00:42, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

Check BettInFlammen.com (Spanish website) -> http://miarroba.com/foros/ver.php?foroid=861599&temaid=3841305 Wollt ihr das BettInFlammen.com sehen? --CHucky 21:30 14 March 2006(UTC)

Pronunciation of r's

Is there some kind of source to the stuff about american "conservatives and christians" having accused Rammstein of immitating Hitler by singing with rolling r's? (If any yankee has a problem with rolling r's they can take it up with every Russian, Spaniard, Swede, Pole etc who uses them.) I don't really see the point in mentioning this since it only works as bizzare guilt-by-association. It seems to me as an excuse to squeeze in the word "Hitler" and the word "Rammstein" in the same sentence.

I did a brief search and came up with http://www.religioustolerance.org/sch_vio6.htm, although they don't source the claim either. It's a fairly reputable site, so I put a link in the article. ~MDD4696 20:57, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

"They have been accused by the German media of being Nazis and fascists. But the association appears weak. One source based this belief on Lindemann's "rolling r's and Adolf Hitler's diction"

So its the German media that accuses them of this? Either way it's vague and hardly relevant - one might as well include a comment an old class mate of mine said! I still think it serves no other purpose than guilt-by-association. Just because some German journalist thinks that he/she can sell a few extra copies by bashing Rammstein doesn't make it worhty of mentioning here.

Yes, it is mainly the german media, for example magazines like Der Spiegel. This does not only stem from the rolling r's or the military beat, but also by articles from music magazines. Music magazines termed bands like Rammstein, Einstürzende Neubauten and Subway to Sally "Neue Deutsche Härte" (new german hardness) - to describe bands that had relatively "hard" music and sang in german, something that musicians in Germany didn't dare to do after Germany's past. Due to this term, the general public somehow associated Neue Deutsche Härte with neo-right ideologies. This was picked up by several conservative journalists, resulting in bands like Rammstein, Subway to Sally and sometimes In Extremo being called Nazis. --NorkNork 16:25, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

So Why not just delete the crap? it would seem to me to be the best way to go about the whole dirty business! Don't just whine about it, fix it! If no sources are cited, then find some or delete the quote. Quite frankly, I love German with the rolling Rs and that is the way only speak it myself. If there can be no real sources cited, then why should this reference not be deleted? -Sbauman487 2:55 26 February 2006 (CST)

I saw no reason to even mention the names of those who comitted the Colombine massacre (they don't deserve such respect), so I removed them. I rewrote the paragraph leading into the "band's" response to the horrific crime perpetrated by these sadistic young men. However, it still lacks a real reference as to where this quote came from! If anyone has any sources here, let 'em fly. -Sbauman487 3:25 26 Febraury 2006 (CST)

More on meaning of the name

If you inquire a German dictionary the only word that I know of that translates from Battering ram is der Sturmbrock. It seems to me that if there is no word "ramm" but it exists in english, and that if "stein" means stone, and then you come up with "ram stone" in english, that doesn't mean that it means the same thing in German.

"Rammen" means "to ram" in German, so the translation "ramming stone" or "ram stone" is perfectly legitimate. --NorkNork 15:24, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

I agree. By the way, there is the word Rammbock which means much the same as Sturmbock -- Genesis 16:22, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

It is the same. Sturmbock redirects to Rammbock on de: . --NorkNork 17:24, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

Signature insturments?

Do members of Rammstein have signature instruments? Sabrebattletank 03:41, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Could you clarify the question? Are you asking about the instruments themselves or the type that they play? ~MDD4696 04:12, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Richard has a signature guitar, ESP RZK-1 [7]/Hugoflug 14:33, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Clarification: Do they play speccific types, like does Flake always play a Korg Triton keyboard? Does the basist play a certain bass?70.21.105.41 19:41, 23 January 2006 (UTC) (Sabrebattletank)

I think Paul Landers plays a Gibson Les Paul. --NorkNork 20:21, 23 January 2006 (UTC)