Talk:Quintin Brand

Nationality

Probably some research could be done on the question of whether Brand counts as South African or British. Commonwealth-UK transfers are always tricky to sort in this respect. Peridon (talk) 11:37, 11 November 2008 (UTC)

He is obviously South African being born there. Wallie (talk) 11:36, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Allegiance refers to the "flag" under which he fought, which in no way, removes his nationality. FWiW Bzuk (talk) 13:24, 2 March 2009 (UTC).

Agree with this. Men from many different nations have fought and still do for the United Kingdom Kernel Saunters (talk) 13:38, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

I don't agree with either of you. You don't have to fight for a flag to have an allegiance to it. That really is a nightmare scenario - continual war. Also, Brand was in the SAAF, even though he didn't fight for them. Wallie (talk)

Is there a reference for his serving in the South African Air Force? I believe he served in the South African defence force from 1914 to 1915, before transferring to the Royal Flying Corps in England. From that point on, he only served as an RAF officer. FWiW Bzuk (talk) 17:17, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

It has him with a Rank of Major. The earlier ref says he is a Lieutenant. Neither of these are RAF ranks. He was a Flight Lieutenant which equates to a Captain. It is possible that he was in both the RAF and SAAF at the same time. Wallie (talk) 17:24, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

The RFC had a rank structure that took its names from the Army - eg the RFC ace Major "Mick" Mannock. GraemeLeggett (talk) 17:34, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

While he was in the South African defence force, he was a "foot soldier", and only later when he transferred to the RFC, and later RAF, did he become an aviator. FWiW Bzuk (talk) 17:38, 14 March 2009 (UTC). Repeating: was he ever in the South African Air Force? FwiW Bzuk (talk) 18:17, 14 March 2009 (UTC).

Here is yet another quote. [1] It says he is a South African and that he was a Major. In the RAF he was a Flight Lieutenant. This is 1920, and the RFC is no longer operating, so the RFC does not come into it. Even if he is a foot solider, he still has allegiance to South Africa. I find this continual reverting irksome. It is easy to do and squashes the truth. Wallie (talk) 18:34, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

So in 1920, he belongs to? the RAF! He is a pilot renowned for a long-distance flight back to his "homeland" but that fact has nothing to do with his military service. The actual cite that you pointed to quite clearly states: "Following the flight Ryneveld and Brand were both knighted and van Ryneveld went on to establish the South African Air Force." Don't confuse nationality or identity with Brand's service standing. FWiW Bzuk (talk) 18:42, 14 March 2009 (UTC).

OK. Thanks. The article seems OK now. :) Wallie (talk) 16:52, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

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