Talk:Patrick O'Donnell (Invincible)

POV-pushing

• Recently rv edits by st o'hara which were blatant propganda. Recommend vigilance by editors. Quis separabit? 18:30, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

Neutrality Respected/ should not use loaded words and phrases

As an historian I find some Wiki articles on Irish history reflect a bias, evidenced by some loaded words and phrases used to describe Irish nationalists, for example. One such example, Irish republican Fenians are said to be committed to "plotting" "acts of terror." In fact, Fenians and other republican groups were viewed as heroes by most Irish, as men fighting against English invaders who had brought suffering and death to Ireland over centuries. Fenians and other such groups planned actions against English rulers and their agents; they were at war with England. In what way does that justify calling them "terrorists" in an article in an encyclopedia? According to such logic the founders of America could also be called "terrorists." Calling acclaimed and honored national heroes of Ireland, who ultimately won freedom for their oppressed country, terrorists is not suitable for an encyclopedic entry-- despite what the American government, loyal to England, may or may not have thought of them at the time. I will not revise your edit. There are comprehensive works on Irish history that accurately describe the reasons the Irish were driven to war with England. I believe careful students of history will make accurate assessments despite the bias of history's "winners." Your definition of terrorism below does not clarify since it could also be a description of warfare. — Preceding unsigned comment added by St o'hara (talk • contribs) 19:38, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

The allegations made in this article that O'Donnell "retaliated against some of those involved in the attacks on his family" in Pennsylvania are referenced only by a book title (Kevin Kenny's book on the Molly Maguires) with no page number or specific source for this information cited. The other citation is a "timeline" of unattributed origin, uncertain authorship, and therefore very problematic as a trustworthy historical reference. — Preceding unsigned comment added by St o'hara (talk • contribs) 16:37, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

I am familiar with the adage "one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter", but that is not how to build articles on an encyclopaedia. As an American citizen, I can say that terrorist tactics were employed in the American Revolutionary War on both sides, and during the American Civil War, for that matter.

The Fenians were regarded in their time, including by the United States government which refused to abet them in their Canadian exploits, as a terrorist organization, as were its successor movements (do I need to spell them out?), and categorized that way on Wikipedia. The Stern Gang, the Irgun, the African National Congress, Hamas, Hezbollah, and many others too numerous to name regard(ed) themselves as patriots and/or claim(ed) to be fighting for freedom. That doesn't necessarily make it so, nor does it pass the NPOV test. Their supporters have their plenty of access to forms of media and propaganda by which to pass on their messages and/or construct hagiographies, but not here. And the term "acts of terrorism" is not loaded or disrespectful, it is an accurate description of bombings, dynamiting, assassinations, etc. Quis separabit? 23:34, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

the bias of history's "winners" —— does that include Michael Collins? Quis separabit? 17:41, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Not all terrorism is warfare and not all warfare is terrorism, but sometimes they intersect. Quis separabit? 17:41, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Updates

Updates should be made in line with Wikipedia policies. Wikipedia is not a blog or a fansite. Text must be validly sourced. Text which is unsourced and/or which violates NPOV will be removed. Quis separabit? 17:52, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Patrick O'Donnell (Invincible). Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110927184452/http://student.ccbcmd.edu/~wbarry/Mollytimeline.doc to http://student.ccbcmd.edu/~wbarry/Mollytimeline.doc
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20121129151347/http://www.red-duster.co.uk/UNION12.htm to http://www.red-duster.co.uk/UNION12.htm

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 17:41, 10 January 2018 (UTC)