Talk:Methoxide

Cut from Main

I removed this content from the main page. This idea has been spread widely amongst the Biodiesel community, though I have seen no scientific evidence indicating it is true. I have a publication on equilibrium of potassium methylate / (methanolKOH) that indicates the statements to be false in most applications (as best as I can interpret). I would be happy to share it, particularly with someone of expertise.

In biodiesel production, methoxide is incorrectly referred to as the product of mixing methanol and sodium hydroxide. This reaction produces water according to the equation

NaOH + CH₃OH -> H₂O + Na⁺ + CH₃O^-.

There is an equilibrium between CH₃O^- and OH^-: CH₃O^- + H₂O <--> CH₃OH + OH^-.

Because the addition of NaOH to CH₃OH only results in a small amount of methoxide in solution, referring to this as methoxide is less correct than saying that it is a sodium hydroxide solution in methanol.

This confusion may have arisen since methoxide is a very powerful base that has been used experimentally in several papers and seems to self perpetuate. As methoxide is a powerful base, and base transesterified biodiesel is a common method of production, the use of sodium methoxide can substantially increase yields, however it is very sensitive to water, as little as 1% in a reaction will stop it from working. Water immediately reacts with the sodium methoxide to form caustic soda (NaOH) and methanol. Since water inhibits the base catalyst, this stops transesterification taking place.

Another problem with water is that in the presence of triglycerides (from the biodiesel reaction) sodium / potassium and water when being mixed will undergo saponification (soap formation), another reason why water must be kept out of the system.

--E8 (talk) 23:34, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

What about the water solutions, methanol is stronger acid than water itself (all other alcohols are weaker), I know nothing about alcohol solutions. Could you indeed cite a bit from the publication You mentioned? --Esmu Igors (talk) 07:18, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

I have the full article, available for preview here, but no way to deliver it to you without an e-mail address.--E8 (talk) 08:44, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

Chembox removal

I removed the chembox, as one already exists at the Sodium methoxide page (complete with images). This page is not about any particular methoxide compound, but rather methoxides in general. When searchers look up topics like Potassium methoxide and Lithium methoxide, which do not have their own developed pages (yet), they end up here. It would help to have chemboxes for those, but again, it would be best if they had their own individual pages.--E8 (talk) 08:37, 26 April 2011 (UTC)