Talk:If You Must (Del the Funky Homosapien song)
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Move request edit
- The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the move request was: no consensus. Jenks24 (talk) 12:54, 20 August 2014 (UTC)
If You Must (song) → If You Must – I see no reason for this page to exist under this title if the other page is a mere redirect (and have been so for many years). It should be renamed, albeit keeping the {{About}} on top of it. Relisted. Jenks24 (talk) 09:22, 12 August 2014 (UTC) Victão Lopes Fala! 18:20, 4 August 2014 (UTC)
- Oppose - If You Must (which I have just per WP:SONGDAB moved out of the way to If You Must (Nirvana song)) was a redirect, but wasn't a mere redirect, it was a category holder in the Category:Nirvana (band) songs category with a project tag, redirecting to the song, which gets coverage in books as Curt Cobain's first demo. A category holder redirect like that shouldn't be deleted. As regards If You Must (Del the Funky Homosapien song), the most useful piece of disambiguation we can provide for mobile users is an infobox jpg, I have uploaded one. Since grunge and rap fans will be looking for different songs and "other songs exist" WP:SONGDAB it would make sense to title both of them recognizably. In ictu oculi (talk) 23:32, 4 August 2014 (UTC)
- And because it's a category holder we'll keep confusing readers? Btw, If you must redirects here, and your redirect is redirecting to another redirect. We already have a couple of things to fix, but anyway we could just either turn If You Must to a disambiguation page (which would be a waste of bytes, since it would be disambiguating a redirect from an article, a situation that is much more easily fixed with a {{Redirect}}) and then rename this very page to If You Must (Del the Funky Homosapien song); or we do what's more logical: kill both Nirvana-related redirects (unless category holders are eternal and untouchable, which I'm unaware of) and keep just the rapper's song article, with a note on top of it clarifying people searching for Nirvana's song - a song that is barely mentioned at the target article, I might add. Victão Lopes Fala! 19:01, 5 August 2014 (UTC)
- How is If You Must (Nirvana song) redirecting to where the Nirvana song is covered, and this song being If You Must (Del the Funky Homosapien song) "confusing readers"? In ictu oculi (talk) 05:18, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
- I said "If You Must (song)" being kept as "If You Must (song)" as if there was another article titled "If You Must" is confusing readers. Anyway, creating a disambiguation page would not reflect our current reality. Why trick readers into believing we have information on three subjects named "If You Must" when we actually have information on only one, since both the Nirvana song and the Precious Death album that you created as a redirect yesterday are barely mentioned at their target pages? Victão Lopes Fala! 20:31, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
- But that's exactly the point, how is that "confusing readers"? What difference does it make to readers looking for If You Must (Del the Funky Homosapien song) whether If You Must (Nirvana song) is covered in the album or separately? The first Nirvana song - which was, remember the WP:PRIMARY redirect until you spotted it - is higher in Amazon mp3 sales, probably of more interest. How is it "confusing readers" to have a full title? It evidently isn't, per WP:PRECISE. In ictu oculi (talk) 21:59, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
- I said "If You Must (song)" being kept as "If You Must (song)" as if there was another article titled "If You Must" is confusing readers. Anyway, creating a disambiguation page would not reflect our current reality. Why trick readers into believing we have information on three subjects named "If You Must" when we actually have information on only one, since both the Nirvana song and the Precious Death album that you created as a redirect yesterday are barely mentioned at their target pages? Victão Lopes Fala! 20:31, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
- How is If You Must (Nirvana song) redirecting to where the Nirvana song is covered, and this song being If You Must (Del the Funky Homosapien song) "confusing readers"? In ictu oculi (talk) 05:18, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
- And because it's a category holder we'll keep confusing readers? Btw, If you must redirects here, and your redirect is redirecting to another redirect. We already have a couple of things to fix, but anyway we could just either turn If You Must to a disambiguation page (which would be a waste of bytes, since it would be disambiguating a redirect from an article, a situation that is much more easily fixed with a {{Redirect}}) and then rename this very page to If You Must (Del the Funky Homosapien song); or we do what's more logical: kill both Nirvana-related redirects (unless category holders are eternal and untouchable, which I'm unaware of) and keep just the rapper's song article, with a note on top of it clarifying people searching for Nirvana's song - a song that is barely mentioned at the target article, I might add. Victão Lopes Fala! 19:01, 5 August 2014 (UTC)
- Support per WP:PRECISE, and the fact that the Nirvana song currently doesn't have an article. Also, the current disambiguator of this article is ambiguous due to the existence of the song on the Nirvana album With the Lights Out (the current target of If You Must, the redirect). Best application in this case would be to establish the existing article as the primary topic, leave the hatnote that is currently on the nominated article as it is, and then start a new discussion when the article for the Nirvana song gets created. Steel1943 (talk) 13:37, 13 August 2014 (UTC)
- Oppose. Notability is down to whether Nirvana or Del the Funky Homosapien is the more notable artist. Fortunately notability is not inherited so it is fair and equal to pay attention to WP:SONGDAB to avoid that situation. --Richhoncho (talk) 19:52, 13 August 2014 (UTC)
- Oppose. This title should just be a redirect. The article fails WP:GNG since there are no sources that substantially cover the topic. If it remains, it should be disambiguated by the artist name per SONGDAB. —BarrelProof (talk) 20:54, 14 August 2014 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.