Talk:George Juskalian/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Hchc2009 (talk · contribs) 16:13, 8 June 2013 (UTC)

Looks like an interesting commander. I'll read through properly and start the review in the next few days. Hchc2009 (talk) 16:13, 8 June 2013 (UTC)

Ready when you are :) Proudbolsahye (talk) 21:33, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Cool. Was waiting for the flurry of copy editing to finish! :) Hchc2009 (talk) 21:38, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Proudb, may I suggest that we tell Hchc that we will let him know when we're ready for his first review after we've implemented all the suggestions already given? We're not ready yet, Hchc. --108.45.72.196 (talk) 21:50, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

The suggestions are FAC suggestions. It may differ for GA. The criteria is different. But the question is how different? Proudbolsahye (talk) 22:00, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

I honestly don't know how they differ (but I'm sure it's all written down somewhere). I'm assuming that implementing them will move the article in the right direction. --108.45.72.196 (talk) 22:40, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Okay. That's fine with me. Proudbolsahye (talk) 22:41, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

I'll stand ready to review when you're both content with the quality. Hchc2009 (talk) 19:23, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Hchc2009, after much review and copyediting. I think were ready to hear your review. Proudbolsahye (talk) 19:26, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

I'm sorry, Proudb, but I have to disagree with you. I don't think we're ready yet. Here's why: the article needs some restructuring to consolidate it into a standard plan. I suggest, after the header paragraphs: 1) Early life 2) Military career 2a) WWII 2b) Korea 2c) Mission to Iran 2d) Missions in New York and France 2e) Vietnam 3) Life after retirement 4) Personal life 5) Recognition 6) Military awards and decorations 7) Refs, etc. --108.45.72.196 (talk) 21:33, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

In other words, current 1.1 becomes 1), current 1.2 moves to 2), current 1.3 becomes 3), current 1.4 becomes part of 3), current 3 becomes part of either 3) or 4), and all the info about wives, children, divorces, etc., moves to 4). --108.45.72.196 (talk) 21:47, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

What to do with active service section? Proudbolsahye (talk) 22:01, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Further suggestions, Proudb: 1). As wonderful as it is, the photo of GJ with his son should be moved down, even to the Personal life section. 2). Good articles rarely have paragraphs that are only one sentence long. 3). Most of the Other activities in the infobox have to go (if he was a writer, we need a list of his written works). 4). The entire POW section needs to be ruthlessly condensed, and I mean ruthlessly (I know it hurts). You're doing great work here, keep it up. Good catch on the arrowhead device, by the way. --108.45.72.196 (talk) 01:17, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

• 1) Done. 2) I'll work on that as well. 3) I found a few of his writings online including, "Harput Revisited", "Why Didn't They Shoot More?", "The Life You Save", "A Journey to New Julfa" and I believe there are many others. The question is...where would a list of his writings go? 4) Ah! You killed me with that one! I think a detailed depiction of his POW days is important because he himself was a highly significant POW and spent years in encamped. If you are going to remove some sentences please please let me know before hand so we can discuss together and maybe shorten them up. Proudbolsahye (talk) 03:35, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

I won't be cutting anything more tonight. It's late. --108.45.72.196 (talk) 05:28, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Ready for review. Proudbolsahye (talk) 16:34, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Is hchc watching? Hchc2009, we're ready for your review for GA. Thanks. --108.45.72.196 (talk) 16:37, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Right, last bits are done, as per below. Then I think we're good for GAR completion. Hchc2009 (talk) 17:46, 27 June 2013 (UTC)

Well-written:

(a) the prose is clear and concise, respects copyright laws, and the spelling and grammar are correct;

I'm going to divide comments into GA points and minor; treat the latter as recommendations, but they aren't essential for GA status.

GA points:

• "George's father Kevork was from Kharpert, Ottoman Empire" - "Kharpert, in the Ottoman Empire" - compare to saying "from Adelaide, British Empire" - it wouldn't quite parse correctly.
• " from Arapkir, Ottoman Empire" - ditto
• "However, Kevork Juskalian felt that there was no secure future for him in the Ottoman Empire and subsequently fled the Ottoman Empire to United States arriving in Ellis Island on November 15, 1887." - "to the United States". You could safely lose the "However" at the beginning.
• "in Worcester Massachusetts" > "in Worcester, Massachusetts"
• "He was also instrumental in the establishment" - you don't need the "also" (which suggests a comparison with the previous sentence)
• "He earned his commission " - as the first sentence of a section, you'll need to be specific here (e.g. "George Juskalian earned his commission...")
• "He left active service and intended to study law at the American University in Washington, D.C. when his father died in 1938" - there's a comma missing here; he surely didn't intend to study law when his father died, but was rather intending to study law, and then his father died?
• "George Juskalian was assigned as first lieutenant " - "given the rank of first lieutenant"?
• "and his group was put under test in Fort Benning, Georgia" - I wasn't sure what this meant.
• "The Allies, who have organized three amphibious task forces" - "who had organized"
• "Juskalian was part of the task force that invaded through the port of Oran with Col. Roosevelt Jr. as brigadier general and assistant 1st Infantry Division commander" - I was confused - is this saying that Roosevelt was a 1*? If so, why is he being titled as colonel?
• "With helpful fire from British battleships" - "supporting fire"?
• "Due to his efforts in the campaign, Juskalian distinguished himself in battle and earned the Silver Star." - The "Due to..." and "distinguished himself..." don't quite align here. I don't think you're saying that he distinguished himself in battle because he worked hard in the campaign?
• " the soldiers that were approaching him from 50 feet away. " - this needs a metric equivalent - you could use the 50 feet (15 m) method if you liked.
• "The POWs were sent to " - POWs will need expanding out from the acronym
• "The tunnel was about 3 feet high by 3 feet wide. " - ditto above
• "Juskalian gave one of his cigars that were gifted from his brother-in-law Hagop Chiknavorian" - would "that had been given to him by his brother-in-law" be simpler?
• "Eventually, the POWs traveled a 350 miles journey" - you'll need a metric equivalent here.
• "Secretariat of the War Department General Staff of the Army" - is there a comma or similar missing here?
• "and preparing briefs for General Eisenhower's perusal and decision" - "and preparing briefs for General Eisenhower." I think the perusal and decision are redundant... having written a few myself! :)
• " Firse Lieutenant Robert C. Gutner " "First"
• " On the night of March 26, Juskalian received orders from Colonel Kern for a withdrawal of his forces" - "to withdraw his forces"
• "In the east of Old Baldy a battle took place at Pork Chop Hill, which was a hill 234 feet high and was made famous by the movie Pork Chop Hill starring Gregory Peck." > "To the east..."; 234 feet will need a metric equivalent; "was later made famous"
• "The Chinese pushed an offensive" There's a word missing here I think.
• "and a successful withdrawal of troops" - "the successful withdrawal of his troops"
• "chief of operations and training at Headquarters, First Army" - I think this should be "at the headquarters of the First Army", but am happy to be corrected.
• "His duties in New York were cut short due to the Berlin Crisis of 1961 where Juskalian would be sent to France to join the 1st Logistical Command. " - "when Juskalian was sent to France"
• " to assume duties of G-3, chief of plans, operations and training" - "to assume the duties", or "to assume the role of..."
• "After his tours of duty in New York and France, Juskalian volunteered to fight in Vietnam in 1962–1963. " - unclear if this meant that we are uncertain when he volunteered (either in 1962 or 1963), or that the process of him volunteering was spread over the two years (which seems odd as first glance)
• " was assigned to Headquarters, Military Assistance Command Vietnam (MACV)" - again, I'd lowercase Headquarters in this format
• "which he kept ever since as a souvenir" - I think that "that he kept for the rest of his life as a souvenir" would be more correct
• "the St. Nerses Shnorhali Award and "Lifetime Achievement and Pastor's Recognition Award" " -unclear why the second is in speech quotes.
• "74th Anniversary of Washington's Armenian Community" - unclear why anniversary and community are capitalised.

Minor:

• " Thereafter, he served first as a minor official" - "He served as a minor official..." would be simpler
• " He was then invited to serve in the Persian consulate in Mezire" - "work in the" would avoid multiple "serves"
• "George Juskalian was also the cousin of famed Medal of Honor recipient of the U.S. Army, Ernest Dervishian.[7]" - Personally, I wasn't sure this felt relevant to Juskalian's article.
• "He was also instrumental in the establishment of the Armenian Church of Our Savior on January 18, 1891." - again, it wasn't clear to me how relevant this felt to Juskalian's story.
• "In August 1942, Juskalian was one of more than 15,000 soldiers of the division who would board the RMS Queen Mary and ship to Europe" - "soldiers of the division who boarded the RMS..."
• "Juskalian became a POW for 27 months and was sent to locations in Italy, Poland and Germany." - "was held in locations in..."?
• "The POWs would partake in various activities" - "The POWs partaked in various activities..."
• "Juskalian became an editor to a monthly newspaper" > "editor of a monthly newspaper"
• " the German troops moved the POWs westward into Germany in order to be clear of the Soviet advance from the east" - "in order to avoid the Soviet advance"?
• "Peter and George walked through an opening in the prisoner compound fence and ran towards Frankfurt in the hopes of reaching the American lines." - to check, I read this as they left the compound, (literally) ran towards Frankfurt, and were then (presumably quite quickly) picked up?
• "After surviving the bombardments in Nuremberg, the POWs were resettled in a camp near Munich. " - You could simplify to "After surviving the bombardment, the POWs..." - the Nuremberg context is established in the previous paragraph.
• "However, they were given the opportunity to return to Nuremberg as wounded soldiers to obtain treatment.[20] The POWs agreed to return to Nuremberg because it was closer to the American lines." > "They were given the opportunity to return to Nuremberg, however, as wounded soldiers to obtain treatment; the POWs agreed, because it was closer to the American lines." It would avoid repetition and be a little shorter.
• "Juskalian was flown to Paris, France where he would present himself at the military post and request financial assistance." - "he presented himself" (active, vice conditional)
• "An officer, who was already acquainted with George's older brother Richard (Dikran)" - "who knew George's older brother"?
• "When asked if he was related to Richard, George responded by saying Richard was his older brother and upon hearing this, he was given all the provisions he needed." - I thought this seemed overly literal/long. How about "George confirmed that Richard was his brother, and he was then given all the provisions he needed."?
• "the staff and faculty of The Infantry School" - I don't think the "The" needs a capital here, but happy to be corrected!
• "While at the School, he availed himself of the opportunity of taking airborne training and qualifying as a parachutist." > "While at the School, he took airborne training and qualified as a parachutist."? (shorter)
• "on inspection visits to the many military installations present there" - could just be "on inspection visits to many military installations" - shorter, and he couldn't inspect units that weren't there! :)
• Personal life section. I'd combine the first two paragraphs, and the third and fourth paragraphs.
• "George Juskalian along with his family moved to Centreville, Virginia in 1989 where he remained the rest of his life." - I'd advise "In 1989, George..."

(b) it complies with the manual of style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation.

Factually accurate and verifiable:

(a) it provides references to all sources of information in the section(s) dedicated to the attribution of these sources according to the guide to layout;

• Yes. Hchc2009 (talk) 11:26, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

(b) it provides in-line citations from reliable sources for direct quotations, statistics, published opinion, counter-intuitive or controversial statements that are challenged or likely to be challenged, and contentious material relating to living persons—science-based articles should follow the scientific citation guidelines;

• Yes. Hchc2009 (talk) 11:26, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

(c) it contains no original research.

• None found so far. Hchc2009 (talk) 11:26, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

Broad in its coverage:

(a) it addresses the main aspects of the topic;

• Yes. Hchc2009 (talk) 11:26, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

(b) it stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail (see summary style).

• Looks good. Hchc2009 (talk) 11:26, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

Neutral: it represents viewpoints fairly and without bias, giving due weight to each.

• Appears neutral at this stage

Stable: it does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute.

• Stable Hchc2009 (talk) 19:47, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

Illustrated, if possible, by images:

(a) images are tagged with their copyright status, and valid fair use rationales are provided for non-free content;

• Yes. Hchc2009 (talk) 19:47, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

• NB: I've cleaned up the Reserve Office photo. Hchc2009 (talk) 11:26, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

(b) images are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions.

• "The Oflag 64 where George Juskalian spent 19 1/2 months out of his 27 months as a POW." I'm not convinced that this is a full sentence; if not, it shouldn't end in a period."
• "George Juskalian and his son Kevork" - v. minor (and thus not a GA review requirement) but I'd give Kevork's surname for completeness in the caption