Talk:Gender roles in Islam

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 23 August 2021 and 18 December 2021. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Roskerjellybean728.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 21:40, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 22 January 2019 and 2 May 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Peer reviewers: Andysmith 2019.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 22:08, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Upon Reflection

Upon reflection, this article actually does not in anyway deal with the Roles ascribed to the genders in Islam. it needs a complete Re-write. --Irishpunktom\^talk 11:35, August 31, 2005 (UTC) Formerly there was a section in the Koran or traditions at least that it is not needful for women to pray — Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.126.51.120 (talk) 19:49, 2 June 2019 (UTC)

Reworking the Article

I think this is a very crucial page. Although it is touched on in Women and Islam, that article cites this page as well. I would like to tackle a serious reworking of the page. Any suggestions, comments, or critiques would be highly appreciated. Cebrown721 5:25, January 30, 2014

Other gender section

I believe that there could be more about dress. For example, what specifically can women wear and not wear? Galleg37 (talk) 22:34, 19 September 2018 (UTC)

Is there a source for the quote? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.148.26.78 (talk) 01:59, 11 February 2014 (UTC)

Plan for reworking the article

In my reworking of the article I would specifically add the differences between the Salafiyyah and Wasatiyyah points of view on gender roles, and I will back up my statements using quotes from the Quran and the hadith as well as scholars like Shaykh Muhammad al-Ghazali and Shaykh Yusuf al-Qaradawi. Influences from the West and from cultural practices from the Arab Peninsula will be mentioned. Further discussion will include expected behavior regarding sexual behavior, drive, activities and orientation, as well as gender relations, dress, marriage and divorce, rights and sense of responsibility. Not all of these will have their own sections as many topics overlap. Masculinities will also be mentioned and have its own section as the article title does not imply exclusively female gender roles.

I continue to ask for suggestions from other Wikipedia users, and I will eventually ask for a review and comments from the Teahouse. A critique from anyone with an Islamic background and suggestions for good passages from the Quran would be very appreciated.

An outline of the article I intend to write:

1 Family (incorporating some of this into “Tradition gender roles”)1. Classical viewpoints (adding new section) 1.1 Salafiyyah (adding new sub-section) 1.2 Internationally (adding new sub-section) 1.2.1 The United States (adding new sub-section) 1.2.2 Malaysia (adding new sub-section) 1.2.3 The Middle East (adding new sub-section) 2 Gender roles in prayer and worship (deleting this section) 2. Liberal viewpoints (adding new section) 2.1 Wasatiyyah (adding new sub-section) 2.2 Effects of globalization (adding new sub-section) 2.3 Western influence (adding new sub-section) 3 Gender roles within marriage (deleting this section) 3. Traditional gender roles (adding new section) 3.1 Cultural traditions (adding new sub-section) 4 Other genders (deleting this section) 4. Sexuality and gender roles (adding new section) 5. Masculinities (adding new sub-section) 5 See also (adding new links) 6 References (using more and different sources)

This is part of a class assignment at Rice University. (Cebrown721 (talk) 03:35, 27 February 2014 (UTC))

Edits to page

Cebrown721, very good edits done to this article! You have organized the information well and added a lot of needed content. One suggestion to add to this article would be linking to other Wikipedia articles. Overall however, I think you are doing good work to an underrepresented article. AllyBremer (talk) 00:36, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Great job so far! I think you've made some great edits as well as organized it more concisely. For the final contribution I might add some more information about different countries like Saudi Arabia, and consider any and all appropriate ways to phrase Islamic names and rituals. I would also consider discussing how gender roles have changed!Njeri Muturi (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 01:46, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Mohammad Akram Nadwi

The article on Mohammad Akram Nadwi tells us that he has written a biographical dictionary of the muhaddithat, the female scholars of Islam. Expecting to find a handful, after eight years he had discovered more than 8000, from as long ago as Umm al-Darda, the wife of one of the companions of the Prophet. The book runs to 53 volumes.

It might be useful to work this in somewhere.

I was led to this discovery by an article about Akram by Carla Powell in The Daily Telegraph Magazine, 14 Nov 15 or possibly 7 Nov, pages 77-81. Powell is clearly interested in the subject. She has just published a book on it called If the oceans were ink. Budhen (talk) 17:33, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

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Edit

Hi, I am adding to the "heehee" section of this page. VHinojosa786 (talk) 20:51, 28 March 2019 (UTC)

Edits to page

Hello! I am researching a few things such as islamic religion, premarital and marital sex, and adding some citations to the page. Looking forward to collaborating on this page! This is for a class project.JaneDoe023 (talk) 21:42, 11 October 2021 (UTC)JaneDoe023 5:40 11, October 2021

Added Citations

Hello, I have added some citations to the pre-marital, marital and Extral martial section. I am currently doing some more research on this topic since this is a very interesting page to work upon. A.Thousand.Wishes (talk) 21:18, 12 October 2021 (UTC)

Requesting inputs

Greetings,

Adequate and nuanced overview for even non– Muslim audience is expected out of the articles Muslims and Muslim world. Whether the articles are achieving that purpose adequately? Requesting and expecting proactive participation in providing inputs from non–Muslim audience too along with Muslim users.

Since the article Muslim world is tagged various improvements it can not be submitted to formal review process still I feel the article deserves more inputs for content improvement.

Requesting your visit to the articles

• Muslims and
• Muslim world

and provide your inputs @

• Talk:Muslims/Archive 8#Requesting inputs and
• Talk:Muslim world#Requesting inputs

Thanks

Bookku, 'Encyclopedias = expanding information & knowledge' (talk) 06:45, 26 March 2022 (UTC)

Nuanced difference in emphasis and need of sourcing

@Septonomic:

I am aware you were doing just copy edit without intention of going into details, still let me have a mention here so may be if not you some other editor/s will be able to give thought and work on it in due course.

IMHO following statement needs sourcing since classical Islamic conservatives will write the thing differently while Islamic feminism will perceive it differently. Difference between 'no clearly defined' and 'no elaborate' is about 'emphasis' which group puts emphasis on which aspects.

Although there are no clearly defined roles for men and women in the Qur'an

IMO "Roles are not clearly defined still why does patriarchy insists on the gender roles ? that is how Islamic feminist will argue and mostly prefer to use term "roles are not clearly defined instead of word 'no elaborate roles'

The second part of sentence "it is strongly implied that each gender provides equally significant contributions to the family realm." this is a conservative patriarchal line.

Earlier status of the sentence was doing some strange mixing of feminist articulation and conservative articulation. Those who are not exposed to this differentiation will end up doing such mixing up.

Although there are no elaborate roles for men and women in the Qur'an,

'There are no elaborate roles' almost means the same thing but reduces feminist emphasis and takes it towards conservative / patriarchal explanation.

Thanks

Bookku, 'Encyclopedias = expanding information & knowledge' (talk) 05:48, 23 April 2022 (UTC)

I’m confused, are you saying ‘clearly defined’ is a better phrase than the single word ‘elaborate’? Or are you simply saying that we need to source the sentence either way? Septonomic (talk) 11:13, 23 April 2022 (UTC)

IMHO sourcing is needed either way. The rest of my commentary is about ideological differences between traditional conservatism and modern Islamic Feminism. That will become clear when one will juxtapose both of them in the article with relevant citations. There are not many editors who understand Islamic Feminism point of view so any intentional or unintentional gradual subversion of their views does not get noticed easily on Wikipedia.

IMHO in positive usage ‘clearly defined’ seems to match with ‘elaborate’ but when used in negative i.e. 'not clearly defined' and 'no elaborate role' seem to make difference in level of emphasis. No doubt as of now 'no elaborate role' is matching with later part of sentence but a Islamic feminist believing in equality would contest any such proposition and most likely then not they would emphasis with wording 'not clearly defined'. Stress in meaning of word 'elaborate' is on 'details' in 'not clearly defined' stress is on lack of clear definition. (Which patriarchy exploits according to I. Feminist point of view).

Again I also need to provide citation for what I am saying when I will go back to those sources I might do that or some one else too can strive to improve by sourcing both sides of the coin.

Thanks and warm regards

Bookku, 'Encyclopedias = expanding information & knowledge' (talk) 11:57, 23 April 2022 (UTC)

islam

Family Some reformist and feminist scholars argue that the concept of guardianship has formed the basis of particular gender roles in Muslim societies. Women are often expected to be obedient wives and mothers, staying within the familial environment. Meanwhile, men are expected to be the protectors and caretakers of their families.[2] However, the majority of Muslim scholars agree that women are not obligated to serve their husbands, do housework, or do any kind of work at home.[9][10] In Shari'a, it is regarded as permissible for a woman to go out for work if she has the consent of her husband. If there is no mutual consent, then it is not permissible for her to go out and work.[11] Until the period of the rise of Islam, there were many ideas of certain actions and behaviors of women that should be expected that were considered traditional gender roles. Women were seen as inferior to men, and women were supposed to behave and respect men. In earlier times, women were seen as the housekeepers and relied on their husbands to protect them since they were not strong enough to take care of themselves.[12]

According to Sayyid Qutb, a prominent member of the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood in the 1950s and 1960s, the Quran "gives the man the right of 'guardianship' or 'superiority' over the family structure to prevent dissension and friction between the spouses. The equity of this system lies in the fact that God both favored the man with the necessary qualities and skills for the 'guardianship' and also charged him with the duty to provide for the structure's upkeep." Qutb's ideologies are still impactful for radical Islamists today, influencing such prominent Middle Eastern leaders as Ayman Zawahiri and terrorists as Osama bin Laden.[13]

In Islamic culture, the roles played by men and women are equally important. Gender roles viewed from an Islamic perspective are based on the Qur'an and emphasize the dynamic structure of the family.[14] As in any socio-cultural group, gender roles vary depending on the conservative or liberal nature of the specific group.

Although there are no elaborate roles for men and women in the Qur'an, it is strongly implied that each gender provides equally significant contributions to the family realm.

Chapter 4, in verse 34, in the Qur'an, states that "men are the maintainers of women,"[15] due to them providing for their family. It is implied that a noble "husband’s responsibilities commit him to support his wife and children, provide education for his offspring, be kind and attentive to his spouse, and be good to his affine”.[16] These values have remained rather consistent throughout the history of Islam. It is culturally understood that women do, and should, rely on men. This is viewed not as a restricting reliance, but as an arrangement to protect women from the distress and inconveniences of the public arenas.[16] It is because of this ideology that women traditionally do not contribute to the household financially, leaving men to be the sole breadwinners.

The woman's role in the home, although different from that of men, is also of great value and importance in Islamic culture. In earlier times, from a very young age, girls traditionally grew up in the women's quarters of the house called the harem. The harem was that part of the house where the female members of the family and household lived. It was normally out of bounds to all males except the master of the house, his sons and perhaps a physician.[17] Here, young girls were familiarized with domestic activities[17] and were taught Islamic laws and values. 196.191.68.108 (talk) 08:28, 22 December 2022 (UTC)