Talk:Electric Loco Shed, Itarsi

Puzzling edits on 11 December 2022

An editor made a couple of edits that added a lot of information, but it also contained some puzzling changes, too. For example, why change the dates on the date and language directives at the top of the page to "MAY 2022"? Besides it being the improper form (the name of the month should only have the initial letter capitalized (not all capitals), what was the change meant to achieve? I am starting this discussion to give the editor an opportunity to explain more fully what they were trying to accomplish with their edits. — Archer1234 (talk) 10:34, 11 December 2022 (UTC)

Hello @Archer1234. I am very glad to know that my contribution to the article, Electric Loco Shed, Itarsi has been reviewed by you and you have suggested some changes to it. Actually I was practicing the edits on my personal sandbox and by mistake I have put the wrong dates on it which were of the time when I actually started to search and find evidences of notability around the web about the article. When I thought that the research is enough, I made an edit publicly on the article. I would also like to request you that if you find my edits useful then please do let my edits also reviewed publicly and take back your revertion. Also, do continue to suggest me changes so that I may become a faithful editor one day! At last, I would say that I would continue to contribute on Wikipedia and also gain knowledge by the positive feed backs made by you. Thank You. Ajendra69 (talk) 10:12, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

File:ET WAP7.jpg

Itarsi-based WAP-7 hauling Narmada Express

File:ET WAP4 22924.jpg

Itarsi-based WAP-4 freshly painted

I will add separate replies for each question I have about your edits. This will give you an opportunity to respond just to each individual question. Here is my first question:

1. Why change the image from this (first image at right):

| image =File:ET WAP7.jpg

| caption = Itarsi-based WAP-7 hauling Narmada Express

to this (second image at right):

| image =File:ET WAP4 22924.jpg

| caption = Itarsi-based WAP-4 freshly painted

— Archer1234 (talk) 11:29, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

The image that I added contains the equilibrium mark as you can see near the door of the locomotive So I thought that this image would be more informative and descriptive containing the mark. That's it, nothing else! Ajendra69 (talk) 10:00, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

Sounds reasonable to me, but I am not involved in train-related articles much, so my opinion does not carry much weight. If no other editors comment here for or against what you propose, then I think you can make the change. If you do add back the image you want, I recommend that you include your explanation for why you are changing it in the "edit summary" of the edit. That will enable all editors to see your reason and not be guessing as to the reason. — Archer1234 (talk) 11:18, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

2. Why this change?

From this:

| opened = {{Start date and age|1980|||df=y}}

to this:

| opened = {{Start date and age|1991|||df=y}}

Can you cite a published reliable source to verify either of these dates? — Archer1234 (talk) 11:32, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Off course @Archer1234 I can cite two published reliable sources which verify the date added by me Ajendra69 (talk) 10:04, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

Great! Cite your sources when you add it back. — Archer1234 (talk) 11:20, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

3. WP:NOTBROKEN says: "Do not "fix" links to redirects that are not broken" and in more details:

There is usually nothing wrong with linking to redirects to articles. Some editors are tempted, upon finding a link to a redirect page, to bypass the redirect and point the link directly at the target page. However, changing to a piped link is beneficial only in a few cases. Piping links solely to avoid redirects is generally a time-wasting exercise that can actually be detrimental. It is almost never helpful to replace [[redirect]] with [[target|redirect]].

But this is what you have done here from this:

| rollingstock = [[WAP-4]] <br> [[WAP-7]] <br> [[WAG-9]]

to this:

| rollingstock = [[Indian locomotive class WAP-4|WAP-4]] <br> [[Indian locomotive class WAP-7|WAP-7]] <br> [[Indian locomotive class WAG-9|WAG-9]]

I am going to assume that you did not know about WP:NOTBROKEN, but this sort of edit is not constructive, so you should avoid it in the future. — Archer1234 (talk) 11:45, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Sorry for that. Will not repeat it again :) Ajendra69 (talk) 10:06, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

4. Why change from this:

[[electric locomotive]]s

to this:

electric locomotives (i.e., delinking "electric locomotives").

This is the first use of "electric locomotives" in the main prose of the article and so it is entirely appropriate to link it, unless you want to argue that it is a "common term" as envisioned by MOS:OVERLINK. Is the reason you delinked it or was it some other reason? — Archer1234 (talk) 11:52, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Delinked bu mistake. Sorry :( Ajendra69 (talk) 10:10, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

5. In the Operations section the following text was added, which contains many claims, but there are no citations of published reliable sources to verify the claims:

It handled prestigious trains like the [[Amarkantak Express]], [[Habibganj–Jabalpur Jan Shatabdi Express|Rani Kamlapati-Jabalpur Janshatabdi Express]], [[Madhya Pradesh Sampark Kranti Express|Sampark Kranti Express]], [[Malwa Express]] & [[Pune–Habibganj Humsafar Express|Humsafar Express]] and many more mail express and suferfast trains. It currently holds 2nd largest fleet of WAP-4 locomotives all over the Indian Railways.

Without citations to published reliable sources, this text cannot remain in the article. If you can include citations, then the text can be returned. — Archer1234 (talk) 12:01, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Yes I can include citations to this section Ajendra69 (talk) 10:09, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

Great! Yes, please do cite your sources. — Archer1234 (talk) 11:21, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

6. Like #5, this added text in the Livery and Markings is not supported by citations to published reliable sources:

Itarsi [[Indian locomotive class WAP-4|WAP-4]]s can be identified by the mark 'ET' under a equilibrium sign on yellow circle beside the door of the locomotive.

— Archer1234 (talk) 12:26, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Actually this thing has been identified by me so I don't think that I can add citations to it :( Ajendra69 (talk) 10:14, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

That is what we call "original research" and that is not allowed on Wikipedia. See Wikipedia:No original research for more information on that. Definitely do not add that back unless you can find a published reliable source that can verify it. — Archer1234 (talk) 11:23, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

7. Regarding the change of the name of the Markings section title to Livery and Markings, I have no concern about changing the name of the section, but note what MOS:SECTIONS says:

Section headings should generally follow the guidance for article titles, and should be presented in sentence case, not title case

So, in this case, the section title should be Livery and markings. — Archer1234 (talk) 12:30, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Okay Done Ajendra69 (talk) 10:12, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

8. The Former locomotives section needs citation(s) to published reliable source(s) to verify each/all entries. — Archer1234 (talk) 12:53, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

I have seen the article WAM-4 in which the section of Former sheds does include Electric Loco Shed, Itarsi in its list thats why I added this section of Former locomotives in the article. Ajendra69 (talk) 10:28, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

You cannot cite another Wikipedia page to verify a claim. So, you will need to find and cite a published reliable source to verify it; otherwise, it will need to stay out of the article. Maybe the WAM-4 article cites a published reliable source for it? — Archer1234 (talk) 11:27, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

9. I do not have any major concerns about the other changes made. The History section looks okay and appears to be well-sourced, but I admit I did not check each one to be sure they supported the claims to which they are attached. I like the inclusion of photos in the table listing of locomotives, but I would not be suprised if other editors did not. You might consider reducing the size of the photos in the table to maybe half their current size?

In any event, I hope you found these questions and points of my concerns helpful for your future editing when you add back some of the content that was reverted. If you have any questions, let me know. Good luck. — Archer1234 (talk) 12:57, 13 December 2022 (UTC)

Extremely thankful to you for your advice! Ajendra69 (talk) 10:30, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

You are welcome. Good luck updating the page. I will continue to monitor the page for a while and will comment if I see anything worth noting. Happy editing! — Archer1234 (talk) 11:29, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

Hello @Archer1234, I wanted to convey the message that I have updated the page Electric Loco Shed, Itarsi and I want you to please recheck it and suggest changes if any. Thank you. Ajendra69 (talk) 10:22, 21 December 2022 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• ET WAP7.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 17:11, 20 December 2022 (UTC)