Talk:Dark Age of Camelot

Tradeskills

I see this page goes back to 2004, but I don't see anything about the economic side of the game, such as Tradeskills, so before I go ahead and add a section I just want to ask if this is viewed as entirely irrelevant, or just not significant enough for inclusion. Cryptonymius 22:44, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I don't think a description of the tradeskills in the game would be irrelevant. It probably doesn't need to be in too great a detail (such as a listing of all of the items craftable) and it shouldn't be a how-to (like "...then if you make orange things, you'll gain craftskill faster..."). I look forward to reading it. ju66l3r 16:13, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Heh, no I'm not quite that crazy. Just tried to give a broad survey of the highlights so that someone who's never played the game would get an idea of what goes on. I resisted the urge to point out that one reason some players develop high-level crafters is to better serve friends and guildmates in the game, because this seems to border on a violation of NPOV. But, on the other hand, I think one thing the article is missing is mention of the fact that the game system really does seem designed to encourage, if not coerce, people to form cooperative groups both for RvR and PvE. Just not quite sure how to say it in objective terms. Cryptonymius 21:59, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Realm versus Realm

Quite often I hear that DAoC has the best systme of any game in regards to RvR (PvP). I think we could really expand the article by citing reviews and ratings of the game that focus on this aspect of the game. Of course, we need to avoid comparisons (aside from what is required) to other games.

LarianLeQuella 20:33, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Oh, here is another area where we can talk more about DAoC: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Player_versus_player#PvP_in_video_games

21:44, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

There should be a correction on the Realm versus Realm innovation. The DAoC system was actually inspired by Darkness Falls: The Crusade, an earlier MUD by Mythic. — Preceding unsigned comment added by SccrRench (talk • contribs) 18:44, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

The RvR play styles section looks like all original research, which is against wikipedia standards.

From Wikipedia:NOR: "Wikipedia does not publish original research (OR) or original thought. This includes unpublished facts, arguments, speculation, and ideas; and any unpublished analysis or synthesis of published material that serves to advance a position. This means that Wikipedia is not the place to publish your own opinions or experiences. Citing sources and avoiding original research are inextricably linked: to demonstrate that you are not presenting original research, you must cite reliable sources that provide information directly related to the topic of the article, and that directly support the information as it is presented." —Preceding unsigned comment added by TwistedSage (talk • contribs) 07:22, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Class by class breakdown

The "classes" section on the main page is nowhere near sufficient to learn what these classes do and if they interest the reader. This topic will hopefully allow a more detailed introduction to each class, so that a reader can gain a better picture of who makes up each realm.

---

Classes of Albion
Fighters are the starting class for the meleers of Albion.
Armsman- Albion's Heavy Tank, Armsmen combine plate armor, high hit points, and high magic resists to be the most durable of the Fighter classes. They can train in one-handed weapons, for use with a shield. They are also able to train in Twohanded weapons and Polearms, as advanced weapon specialization for a significant increase in damage.
Mercenary- Mercenaries are the Light Tanks of the realm. They can train in shield use, but are normally dual-wielders with high damage output. They have very high hit points, though not quite as high as an Armsman, and use chain armor instead of plate.
Paladin- Paladins are the holy warriors of Albion. They combine the weapons and armor of an Armsman with spells and Chants from the Church of Albion. They do not recieve the melee prowess or hit points of the Armsman and Mercenary, as befits their hybrid status. Instead they bring additional performance to themselves and their group from their spell line. In addition to the basic one-handed weapons for use with shields, Paladins are able to train in Twohanded weapons.
Reaver- Reavers are the counterparts to the Paladin. Where the Paladin uses his magic for healing and defense, the Reaver's magic is based on draining an enemy's health and debilitating them. In addition to the basic one-handed weapons, Reavers have access to Flexible weapons, which adds a bit of a twist to the class. As with other hybrids, they have lower hit points and melee damage compared to the tanks, but augment their performance with spells for a very well rounded package.
Mauler- The Mauler class is shared by all three realms. They wear only leather armor, and can wield only Mauler Staff weapons or Fist Wraps. These hybrids bring even lower hit points and melee damage than the Paladin or Reaver, and in turn bring an even wider array of magic abilities to lean on. Their magic, depending on the paths trained, can be offensive, defensive, or utilitarian in nature, with the most potent paths normally combining some aspects of at least two spell lines.

Acolytes are the starting classes for the holy men of Albion.
Cleric- Clerics are the primary healers and primary buffers of the realm. They do not train in weapons or defense, though they wear chain armor and bear a shield. They have three paths to train in: Rejuvenation for healing, Enhancement for buffs, and Smite for offense. Rejuvenation, in addition to basic healing, offers several cures, resurrections, and advanced heals. Enhancement brings powerful stat buffs and magic resistance buffs, and also the ability to shear an enemy's buffs off of him. Smite is the offensive line for a Cleric that grants direct damage spells, a stun, and some minor defensive crowd control.
Friar- Friars are the melee counterpart to the Cleric. Where the Cleric's strengths are in casting, the Friar is a front-line meleer. The Friar's heals (Rejuvenation) and buffs (Enhancement) aren't as strong, but still valuable. But they can train in Staffs for significant melee ability. They wear only leather armor, but can enhance their durability with self-buffs and high evasion skill.
Heretic- As the Reaver is the counterpart to the Paladin, so the Heretic is the counterpart to the Cleric. Heretics share some of the basic healing and buffing skills of the Cleric. But for them, training in Rejuvenation brings powerful damage spells. Training in Enhancement brings powerful self-buffs that raise their durability to rival tanks. And they can train in not only shield use, but Crush weapons and the Flexible weapons line shared with Reavers.

Rogues are the stealth classes of Albion.
Infiltrator- Infiltrators are the assassins of the realm. They combine stealth with powerful surprise attacks in their Critical Strikes line, and powerful poisons in their Envenom line. These combine to make a class that has relatively low hit points and melee output into a fearsome opponent. They can train in Thrusting and Slashing weapons, and wear only leather armor.
Scout- Scouts are the archers of the realm. They too have the stealth skill, but where the Infiltrator uses it to get close the Scout uses it to deliver powerful ranged attacks with their bow. While the Infiltrator uses poisons to debilitate his opponent, the Scout uses self-buffs to increase his performance. Scouts can wear studded armor and train in shields for defense, but have the same lower hit points and melee damage of the Infiltrator.
Minstrel- Minstrels are a musician class. While they can stealth, they also perform important group roles with their songs that can aid in travel speed, mana regeneration, hit point regeneration, water breathing, and melee damage absorbtion. They also bring some minor damage spells and crowd control to their group. While a powerful class in it's versatility, Minstrels suffer from the mediocre performance in their many skills that characterize hybrids. Still, a strong and fun class when played to its strengths.

Elementalists are robed casters that specialize in elemental magic.
Theurgist- Theurgists are described as both utility casters and damage casters, depending on who you ask. And truly, they offer both facets. In their Earth line of spells, they have some buffs, debuffs and damage spells to aid their group and can summon earth elementals that chase and melee the enemy they are summoned on. In their Ice line of spells, they have roots and snares to control the flow of battle, damage spells, and can summon ice elementals that cast snare/damage spells on their target. The Wind magic line brings the most potent damage spells, and minor crowd control, and also allows for the summoning of air elementals that chase down and stun their target. While a Theurgist lacks the brute force of a Wizard, they bring a powerful array of skils to a group.
Wizard- For the finesse that a Theurg brings, the Wizard is the sledgehammer counterpart. Their Fire magic line brings some of the most powerful ranged damage. Their Ice magic line brings some ranged damage, but specializes in point-blank area effect spells. Their Earth magic line is a bit more subtle, but still packs both direct damage and damage over time spells with snares and nearsight spells that can suppress enemy casters.

Mages are robed caster that specialize in attacking the body and mind.
Cabalist- Cabalists are a pet-caster that can summon a powerful Simulacrum to do their bidding. As they level, they gain access to a variety of Simulacrums that have different traits to make them useful for different jobs. The Cabalist can train in Spirit Animation magic, that grants spells to buff his pet and also debuffing spells that make his opponents weaker to magical attacks. He can also train in Matter magic, that grants damage-over-time spells, nearsight spells to suppress enemy casters, and a focus shield that causes severe damage to anything that hits his pet. The third spell line for the Cabalist is Body Destruction magic, that grants them powerful lifetap spells and health transfer spells, as well as disease that inhibits an enemy's movement and ability to be healed.
Sorcerer- Sorcerers are a pet-caster as well, but in this case training in Mind Mastery grants them the ability to charm monsters to do their bidding. Mind specialization also grants powerful, long range crowd control spells. In Matter Manipulation magic they gain access to damage over time spells and damage/snare spells. In Body magic, a Sorcerer gains direct damage and lifetap spells, roots, and debuffs.

Disciples can choose only to become Necromancers, a very unique type of caster.
Necromancer- The Necromancer is unique among casters in that he summons a pet to do his bidding, but unlike other casters that use pets he becomes an insubstantial shade while his pet is summoned and cannot be attacked as long as his pet survives. The trade off is that all of his spells are cast THROUGH his pet; without his pet the Necromancer can do nothing but summon a new one. The first of the Necromancer's spell line options is Deathsight. This line grants powertaps that ensure that he'll almost never run out of power and lifetaps that ensure his pet can survive a lot of damage. The second spell line is Painworking, and grants single target and area of effect damage over time spells, and a buff that makes the pet stronger and more durable. The last spell line for a Necromancer is Death Servant. This line grants a powerful point-blank-area-effect spell and a short-range direct damage spell, as well as a powerful damage shield for the pet that damages anything that hits it. The pet also gets a buff that makes him more agile and a better caster.

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Classes of Hibernia
Guardians are the meleers of Hibernia.
Hero- Heroes are the Heavy Tanks of Hibernia, and like the Armsmen of Albion enjoy the highest hit points and magic resists of the realm. They also have the special ability to periodically shapeshift into a giant stag for a massive increase in hit points. They can train in the standard one-handed weapons of the realm for use with a shield; they can also train in the advanced Large Weaponry and Celtic Spears for higher damage at the expense of not equipping a shield. With solid melee damage, high hit points, scale armor, and high defensive training Heroes are durability personified.
Blademaster- Blademasters are the Light Tanks of the realm. While they, like the Mercenary, can train in the use of shields they are normally found dual wielding for massive melee damage output. While they wear only reinforced armor, they have better evasion skill than Mercenaries which, combined with their high hit points, makes them a pretty durable meleer. To augment their melee output, they can periodicaly summon a magical 3rd sword (called Triple Wield) to attack along with their standard weapons.
Champion- Champions are a hybrid meleer that uses spells to buff himself and to debuff his enemies. Champions wear scale armor and can train in the standard one-handed weapons of the realm, and shields for defense. Most often though, you'll find them wielding Large Weapons for increased offense to complement their offensive spells. While they don't have the hit points of a real tank, the Champion's ability to cripple his opponent with debuffs serves him well.
Vampiir- A Vampiir doesn't have to begin as a Guardian, but upon recieving his advanced class becomes considered a melee class. Vampiirs have the high hit points of a tank, but that's where the similarity ends. They are melee/magic hybrids, that wear only leather armor. They wield only Piercing weapon, and have 3 spell lines they can train in: Shadow Master, Vampiric Embrace, and Dementia. Vampiirs gain power by attacking their enemy with melee, and lose this power quickly if they remain out of combat. Depending on the spell lines they've trained in, they can use the power they gain by attacking their opponent to cast various self-buffs, debuffs and magic attacks. To help overcome the low armor and lack of defensive skills, Vampiirs recieve significant strength, constitiution, dexterity and quickness enhancement as they level up so that at level 50 they have stats that compare to a fully buffed character. The trade-off is that they cannot benefit from the buffs that other classes can.
Mauler- The Mauler is a class shared by all three realms. See the Albion description, as they are identical in each case.

Naturalists are the healing and buffing classes of Hibernia
Druid- Druids are the primary healers and buffers of Hibernia. Like Clerics they gain advanced heald, cures and resurrection spells by training into their healing line, Regrowth. Also similar to Clerics, they gain powerful stat buffs and magic resistance buffs by training in their buffs line, Nurture. A major difference from Clerics comes in their Nature line, compared to Smite for Clerics. In Nature they can gain the ability to summon a pet to fight for them, damage over time spells, and buffs that enhance their melee damage. They also gain a variety of root spells to hinder their opponents.
Bard- Bards are the music class of the realm. While they CAN train in melee weapons, very few choose to sacrifice their powerful spells for weak melee. Their songs come from training in the Nurture line, and include speed enhancment, endurence regeneration, mana regeneration, and magic resistance. Additionally, Bards are Hibernia's primary crowd control class and gain powerful mezmerizing spells and amnesia spells in their Music line. Very few groups consider themselves complete without a Bard, so while considered a weak soloer they are welcome in most groups.
Warden- Wardens are the heal/melee hybrid in Hibernia. Their spell lines combine self-buffs and defense, with in-combat healing to compliment their "front lines" status. They can train in Blades and Blunt weapons, shield use and parry to create a very durable class. While their melee damage output isn't terrifying, they bring a lot of utility to their groups. While normally considered a group-friendly class, their durability allows them to be strong soloers as well.

Magicians are the the primary casters of Hibernia.
--more coming soon--

---

Classes of Midgard
--coming soon--

Doeridid 02:25, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Detailed Guild Information

One of the most appealing systems released with Dark Age of Camelot is the ability to form player-ran guilds. Each guild comes with its own chat channel, in-game ranking system, territory claiming ability, guild banking system, guild housing, and reward system in the form of guild bounty points and merit points. Each guild leader (or leaders, as the game provides for multiple leaders) can define their own set of rules and goals. Furthermore, alliances can be formed between player guilds, which offer up a conjoined chat channel for all guilds within one alliance to communicate.

Forming a Player-Ran Guild
Any player can form a guild. To do so he or she must have a full group of non-guilded players with the guild leader in the top position of the group. The group must then visit Guild Registrar NPC, found in the major cities of each of the three realms. The guild leader must have on their person the amount of one (1) gold piece, then select the NPC and type /gc form <Guild Name>. Each guild name must be unique to the server. Each member of the group receives a small dialogue box asking if they accept membership in the new guild and once they all accept, the guild is formed.
(more to come) Comment added by Mariza21 (talk • contribs) 03:44, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

References? Reception? Criticism?

Why no critical content such as:

• Comparison to other games released the same year
• History of the playerbase, especially as newer games have been released
• Updates in graphics/server technology over time to refresh the visuals
• How the gaming industry viewed and views Daoc
• Other projects Mythic is working on and if resources were reassigned
• Notable events and players (that qualify under Wikipedia:notability
• How this game is/was significantly different from other mmorpgs (eg, the deep and complex rvr system)

Rather than have 10 pages of spell lists and character profiles that can be read in a game guide or on the box, this article should have some facts that might be of interest to folks a few years down the road. Someone looking back down the road, will they care what race/realm had which spells or will they care that x% of players left/joined after the release of expansion x, or how the game compared to game y? Compare this article with Everquest, for what I mean. Gront (talk) 21:36, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

This whole article is written as if it were an advertisement for the game. It isn't neutral or particularly encyclopedic in any way, and you can already find all of this information on a gaming website. 24.155.210.226 (talk) 15:28, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Subscription fee

Y'know what is one of the mose frustrating things about looking for a new MMO? Finding out how much the damn thing costs to play. Why is this information not easily available on the MMO's site to begin with, let alone being nowhere on the game's Wiki page either. It should be one of the primary things listed about a game but it is treated like the monthly cost is just an insignificant thing not even worth mentioning. In fact I STILL don't know how much Dark Age of Camelot costs to play. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.242.171.169 (talk) 16:17, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

If the price isn't listed, just assume $15. Dreg102 19:41, 27 March 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dreg102 (talk • contribs)

There's actually a wikipedia policy on this, WP:NOPRICES. The reasoning for why things like that are not covered is outlined there. Its a larger discussion than just this article so if you believe something like this should be changed, I'd recommend bringing it up the policy talk page.Caidh (talk) 21:03, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Possible Source

Described in Matt Barton's Dungeons and Desktops: the History of Computer Role-playing Games (viewable at Amazon). Extensive coverage on pages 411-412, with a screenshot. Jodi.a.schneider (talk) 07:17, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Origins of QQ expression

I think the claim that 'QQ' originated on the DAoC forums is debatable at best.

• First, we know that 'QQ' was the command to quickly (immediately) quit text-based MUDs which were the predecessors to modern MMORPGs, so to tell someone to 'QQ' was telling them to quit the game completely (typically, out of frustration). 'QQ' was the command instead of a single 'Q' probably because it was easy to mistype a single Q instead of the W key for 'west', and also because the prefix 'q' referred to a 'quick' version of the base command. (eg. http://ireland.iol.ie/~ecarroll/mud/mudhelp.html#abbreviations)
• Second, it is claimed that Alt-Q+Q was the key combination to quit the Warcraft II client completely, exiting out of a match and back to the lobby (http://www.wowwiki.com/QQ)

Given that the eastern emoticon for crying eyes is actually 'Q_Q', it seems likely that the above two functional uses were combined with the emoticon to imply crying while quiting. I'm not sure why this article attributes this combination to the DAoC forums, especially given the 'reference' is just a link to the Scott Jennings wikipedia page.

- Avaera (talk) 01:33, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

I agree that this origin seems doubtful. I'd like point out though that the citation is not just a link to the Scott Jennings page. The reference is quite clearly a book written by Jennings called Massively Multiplayer Games For Dummies. -- Fyrefly (talk) 18:34, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

Actually, according to this google book link, the citation seems to be accurate:Massively Multiplayer Games For Dummies. So, unless someone can come up with a source to dispute this, we should be removing the disputed tag. -- Fyrefly (talk) 18:39, 14 April 2013 (UTC)

Actually you are quite correct about the reference being more complete - I overlooked that, my apologies. Could I suggest then that the sentence about the claimed origins of this expression be prefixed with the source of the claim, given that it is from an employee of the publisher? Perhaps something like, "According to Scott Jennings, an employee of Mythic Entertainment, ..." Avaera (talk) 19:25, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

I understand where you're coming from, but I think it would be a bad precedent. Many, many cited sources on Wikipedia, and especially in video game articles, are official press releases and the like. If we started showing attribution every time the source is an employee, it would get out of hand very quickly. I think the fact that it's a published book and meets the requirements for a reliable source are enough to let the statement stand on its own. -- Fyrefly (talk) 20:01, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Fair enough, though I would say that the distinction here is that the publishing company is not just describing their product, but the alleged influence of it on the genre as a whole. At least in this case it's a fairly minor claim, I suppose, and countered enough elsewhere that it shouldn't be too much of a problem. Thanks for investigating it further Fyrefly. (Edit: Also, I would suggest a better candidate for this section would seem to be the origin of the 'Realm-vs-Realm' term and concept, which actually relates directly to game functionality rather than the supposed inventions of its playerbase.) - Avaera (talk) 20:14, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

It's a reliable source, verifiable, and notable. There is nothing to discuss other than findings from other reliable sources mentioning its origins, or it's simply original research. And if one were found we would simply add it to the statement already present if it was noteworthy, not remove it. Also, he may have been implying when the term was brought mainstream in contrast to being a niche term used by smaller gaming communities as you noted. As Fyrael already stated, there are really no real grounds to dispute given it satisfies the main pillars. DrNegative (talk) 22:39, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

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