Talk:Bort (name)

The Simpsons reference.

I've reinserted both the Simpsons reference, and the image. I don't see how an image can be claimed to be "useless" when it contains the article subject - keyring/license plate names are a common thing. Chaheel Riens (talk) 22:34, 13 January 2018 (UTC)

I challenge whomever removed it to find any other thing with the name Bort on it. Except maybe a legal document. VoidHalo (talk) 20:40, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

It's a custom-made license plate keychain referencing the Simpsons joke, though, isn't it? You can buy these things printed with anything you like on them.

The article shouldn't be implying that Bort is a common enough first name in the US that mass produced souvenir keychains exist. And I guess it's WP:OR to say in the caption that the keychain is Simpsons merch or custom-made by a fan or bought from an Etsy store, since we don't know where it actually came from. (The Flickr user just makes a Simpson's reference in the photo description.)

I rewrote the article to explain the Simpsons joke and to move the photo next to that paragraph, but I now think the article is probably better without the photo at all. I've removed it. Belbury (talk) 09:33, 26 July 2023 (UTC)

Excellent idea. Context is key and explaining it will help clarify the article. While I personally think it seems far fetched that somebody would assume it's a popular name because of the picture, it's best not to make assumptions about knowledge of readers.

So, I agree with your change. It retains the original image, and joke, but doesn't leave people who are unfamiliar with The Simpsons in the dark. A good Wiki article should transcend cultures in this way, where reasonably possible, of course. VoidHalo (talk) 08:45, 2 August 2023 (UTC)

My change was ultimately to remove the image. I don't think Wikipedia can say "this keychain is a Simpsons joke" in a caption because we don't know where the object actually came from or why it exists. Belbury (talk) 09:39, 2 August 2023 (UTC)

I think it's pretty self evident where it came from to anyone who knows the joke.

Regardless, now that I think about more, I think inside jokes have no place on Wikipedia. People aren't coming here for a laugh, they're coming here for objective information. I mean, you wouldn't expect to see such a thing in the Oxford Dictionary, or Encyclopedia Britanica.

In this case, I think it was relatively benign, but such jokes could certainly make articles more confusing and obscure. Not to mention it makes the content VERY Amero-centric to have a reference to a joke from an American TV show, and expecting everyone will get it. A good Wiki article should be globally applicable. At least, as much as an English article can be.

I realize there will probably be some inevitable degree of localization due to the language of an article. But, I think my point about global applicability stands.

So, self evident or not, I think it's a triviality atbthis point. VoidHalo (talk) 15:01, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

I mean the origin of the object: it's either official/unofficial Simpsons merch, or something the photographer had printed at a place that lets you put any word onto a keychain. It's probably the latter, but by the time we've explained any of these things in the caption (that this is a crafted reference to the Simpson's joke rather than evidence that yes, US souvenir stalls do often have items with the name Bort), it's not funny any more.

The text should say what the Simpsons joke was, though, if it's mentioning the joke at all. The current article has been cut back to The name was used as a gag twice in The Simpsons. which is meaningless to a reader who hasn't already seen the episode. Belbury (talk) 15:39, 27 September 2023 (UTC)

Well, the fact that it was used as a gag in The Simpsons might be of interest to somebody unfamiliar with the series if their name was Bort. I think if I had a unique surname lile Bort, I would be really confused and curious if I saw it on some souvenir out of context. But honestly, how many people would fit into that category AND have specifically looked for this page.

I'm imagine in the west a good number of people named Bort have probably heard OF the joke from somebody making a remark about it, at the very least. But that's just speculation. VoidHalo (talk) 00:03, 28 September 2023 (UTC)