Talk:2016 IIHF World Championship

IIHF World Championship

Please don't make this article a re-direct to 2016 Men's World Ice Hockey Championships, as this article only deals with the championship round of the entire tournament. See other IIHF World Championship articles. GoodDay (talk) 16:11, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

Seeding

Sure that France and Germany will be in the same groupe? Both are host of the following championship and can't relegated to Division I A --141.6.11.14 (talk) 15:49, 20 May 2015 (UTC)

Yes, IIHF themselves have said they will be in the same group according to the source. Qed237 (talk) 18:26, 20 May 2015 (UTC)

Relegation

"Since the rules state that "the bottom ranked two teams will be relegated" and the 2017 hosts (France and Germany) cannot be relegated by rule, it remains possible for both relegated teams to come from Group A." I would say that sentence is wrong, and is not meant in the source given, and should be deleted. In no circumstances can be 2 teams from group A be relegated, either the 8th of group A and the 8th or 7th from group B will be relegated or only the 8th from group A will be relegated.--Je suis blocked by Darkwind 17:23, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

And your evidence for this is what exactly? The rules state that next year's host cannot be relegated, they also say that the "overall bottom ranked two of the 16 teams of the final ranking" will be relegated. If it is as you say then would they not specify that the bottom team from each group is to be relegated? It has never occured yet, if you know of an occasion where the IIHF has addressed this specifically please share it.18abruce (talk) 19:27, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

And the evidence that both teams can be from one group is what? --Je suis blocked by Darkwind 19:35, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

The rules I stated; host cannot be relegated, and the bottom two ranked teams are relegated. So if the host is amongst the bottom two the `14th ranked team will be relegated (like in 2009). So since the 14th ranked and either the 15th or 16th ranked team could come from the same group, then it is hypothetically possible for them both to be from the same group. Nowhere does it state the bottom from each group, please provide a reason for your belief that this is true.18abruce (talk) 19:45, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

The normal way is, the 8th placed teams from each group are relegated, not the 15th and 16th overall, that is the mistake you make.--Je suis blocked by Darkwind 19:50, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Her it is stated: [1], Final Ranking, 1., which means, the place in the group is first criteria -> the 15th and 16th are the 8th placed teams of the groups, the 13th and 14th are the 7th placed teams, a 7th placed is always higher ranked than the 8th placed from the other group, even if it has less points.--Je suis blocked by Darkwind 19:57, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Good lord, I am done wasting my time on this. What happens if next year's host is one of the 8th place teams...that means that the 14th ranked team is relegated, which obviously could be from the same group that the host did not come from. Please make an attempt to consider what happens if next year's host is 15th or 16th, like in 2009.18abruce (talk) 20:10, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

2009 another format was played, so mentioning 2009 makes no sense. But O.K. in this case they can be from the same group. And if you learned, that in a normal year the overall two last teams are from different groups as I showed you in the source, that's no wasting of time :-) --Je suis blocked by Darkwind 22:06, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Every year has a future host, so every year has the same situation. Please read this over and over and over until it sinks in.18abruce (talk) 23:20, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Since neither Germany nor France is going to be relegated, I suggest the language be deleted altogether. MrArticleOne (talk) 21:57, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Oh, I am mis-interpreting the (E) that was put next to Hungary. I thought that meant Hungary was being relegated, but I guess it only means that Hungary can't advance to the Quarterfinals? This new table format we're using with the big bold letters in parentheses is very confusing to me. MrArticleOne (talk) 21:58, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

No worries, I believe in previous years we removed this rule as soon as it was no longer possible.18abruce (talk) 23:31, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Last in each group is relegated unless France or Germany is last. Then the 14th worst team will be relegated instead. That would be 7th in Group A or B. It doesn't go by points as ranking is done between teams in the same position finish between groups. Points are after that. Switzerland for example can finish 7th still but with 7 points already they would be better than the #7 in Group B who can at most have 6. That's why they are listed as can't be eliminated. There is one exception to what I said at the start. If France and Germany finish #7 and #8 in their group then only 1 team will be promoted. But after Hungary won vs Belarus, Germany can no longer finish worse than 6th so that is not possible and Italy is finally promoted. 24.36.241.34 (talk) 18:44, 14 May 2016 (UTC)

Please look again, if HUN could not catch GER how would FRA and GER finish 7th and 8th?18abruce (talk) 19:12, 14 May 2016 (UTC)

It's still uncertain, whether two teams from group A can be relegated:
"Note: If the co-hosts for the 2017 IIHF Ice Hockey World Championship (Germany and France) end up in positions 7 and 8 in Group B during the 2016 IIHF Ice Hockey World Championship, only one team will be relegated – the 8th-ranked team of Group A – and only the winner of the 2016 IIHF Ice Hockey World Championship Division I Group A will be promoted."
According to the wording of this note, the IIHF sees the 7th from group B as the next relegated team in line.
If the 14th overall (the 7th with the worse record) is to be relegated, then the note should be:
"Note: If the co-hosts for the 2017 IIHF Ice Hockey World Championship (Germany and France) end up in positions 7 and 8 in Group B during the 2016 IIHF Ice Hockey World Championship and France or Germany as 7th has a worse record than the 7th in group A, only one team will be relegated – the 8th-ranked team of Group A – and only the winner of the 2016 IIHF Ice Hockey World Championship Division I Group A will be promoted."
If Germany or France as 7th had a better record than the 7th of group A, they wouln'd be in a relegation place and the note would make no sense. But as neither of the two will probably finish last, we will never know.--Je suis blocked by Darkwind 10:54, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

References

Tie

Can someone provide an explanation for how the Sweden/Germany tie is broken in the final standings? I am not questioning the accuracy of what's represented, but a note of explanation would be neat. MrArticleOne (talk) 01:12, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

Look here, specifically under the heading "Final Ranking/World Ranking". Sweden tops Germany in GD 5 to 2 (rule #3), the new table confuses matters by adding the QF result ("losing teams of the quarter-finals will be ranked following their positions in the groups preceding the quarter-final round.")18abruce (talk) 01:52, 20 May 2016 (UTC)