Draft talk:Trial of John Haggerty

What should this article be about?

I notice the author of this draft has a motive for writing this article which is to explain the murder of Melchior Fordney that seems to occur in connection with the many connections to the Fordney Rifle that appear on the internet or elsewhere. The author notes he is having difficulties finding independent sources in relation to the Trial of John Haggerty. To me, this suggest the trial is not particularly notable, which is why the draft has not been accepted. However, the murder itself is likely to be notable, because it is often mentioned in connection with his rifles when they come up for auction or are discussed on gunsmith websites. Wikipedia's naming conventions about murders include advice to name articles as Murder of <victim>. Also, advice about writing about the perpetrator of a crime indicates that "A person who is known only in connection with a criminal event or trial should not normally be the subject of a separate Wikipedia article if there is an existing article that could incorporate the available encyclopedic material relating to that person." I wonder if a change of tack is needed here, and if it would be better to write about the murder of the gunsmith on the basis the murder is more notable, because it is mentioned in relation to his rifles when ever these are discussed. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 04:30, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

I agree. I think there's definitely a notable article out of what's provided here. Not exactly sure what kind though. PARAKANYAA (talk) 21:19, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

I wonder if a biography of Melchior Fordney (also spelled Melchoir) is the best option here. According to this National Museum of American History catalogue note "He was famous for his Kentucky rifles." The only reason that John Haggerty appears notable is for Fordney's murder. That means Haggerty is only notable for Fordney's murder, and while his insanity defense might mark its first use in American law, the defense was unsuccessful in his case. Also, there is supposedly an earlier precedent in English law, from which much American law is derived. So I am not so sure an article about Haggerty's murder trial is notable by itself, either. However, Fordney, in addition to his murder, is a gunsmith (i.e. a creative person or craftsman famous for manufacturing Kentucky rifles. Fordney's untimely death probably would not be notable if he was not known for the firearms that he produced. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 23:40, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

Yeah I agree. I think a Melchior Fordney article would be good. Basically all of the content here could still be contained within that article IMO. I know the creator's preference was that there be two articles, but since he seems to be equally famous for being a famous gunsmith and being a victim of a high-profile and legally precedent murder I think both are best covered under one article- though I could look into this more to see. PARAKANYAA (talk) 19:02, 7 January 2024 (UTC)