Category talk:The Chronicles of Prydain character redirects to lists

Can you help me out here?

To editor P64: – Hi, P64! I was going through all the rcat categories and I came across this one, and I'm trying to put 2 and 2 together. On the surface it appears that this is not a "standard" category, especially since it is not named by using the actual title of novel series, The Chronicles of Prydain, and also because that article actually does contain a list of characters, which is covered in the template documentation: Use this rcat on any mainspace redirect from a fictional character to a list in which the character is an entry: if the character is included in and redirected to a list, either: [...] or containing character entries that are not themselves sections. Also use {{R to anchor}} where appropriate. So these are still redirects to lists and, it seems to me, they should be sorted to Category:The Chronicles of Prydain redirects to lists. If they are sorted to a category that just has a part of the series name, like this one, then we may be going in the wrong direction with this – at least so it seems. It does not conform to all the other "character redirects to list categories" and would be very confusing to an editor who comes along and wants to sort a Prydain character to a list category, don't you think? – Paine  07:07, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

Evidently I should get back to the Narnia and Prydain redirect categories that I created at the turn of June/July. I intended report to WP Redirects or Categories, as well as too briefly in your user space, but traveled for 10 days from July 4.

I will continue and clean up some things that are in the forefront of my brain and in memos atop my own user pages. Remind me if i don't get to this today/tomorrow.

By the way, do you know why Category:Prydain redirects --the parent by analogy to Category:Middle-earth redirects-- displays "14 days ago" when I last edited July 2? (Usually my construction templates are more promptly removed by a robot, with notice on my watchlist, perhaps not done for Category pages.) --P64 (talk) 16:46, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

Did you click on "update"? (purge your cache) 72.185.153.30 (talk) 17:45, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

I was at a public station, one of numerous sessions there but I would not expect to have a cache. -P64

1a

The names of these eight Narnia and Prydain redirect categories are analogous to Middle-earth redirects and I would have done the same --would propose the same-- for Oz and Pern and Harry Potter aka Potterverse. (In polar contrast to Middle-earth, none of the hundreds of redirects related to these NOP fictional universes, or almost none, were in redirect categories as of one month ago.) None of these collections of pages, as I would define them, is strictly limited to a book series; even Pern as The Atlas of Pern (albeit no related redirect pages, evidently). Prydain has a short story collection by Alexander, The Foundling and Other Tales of Prydain; one film, The Black Cauldron (film); and one video game, now a section The Black Cauldron (film)#Video game. Those three all have related redirect pages, all of which are under Category:Prydain redirects. In effect I handled 'Prydain' as the name of a franchise, or latent task force or wikiproject (whose realization would be silly).

'Prydain' and 'Oz' differ from 'Middle-earth', 'Narnia', 'Pern', and 'Harry Potter' in that the Oz wikiproject and latent eponymous Prydain task force do not own the pages Prydain and Oz. "Prydain is the modern Welsh name for Britain. ..." and Oz names a disambiguation page that leads "oz. is a common abbreviation for the ounce."

'Prydain' and 'Pern' differ from the other four in that all those name portals (under Category:Literature portals), and also name task forces or wikiprojects.

1b

The names of the six Narnia redirects and Prydain redirects subcategories are those now generated by redirect templates: "... character redirects to lists", "... element redirects to lists", "... location redirects". The latter differs because I created it thus, last month.

2

The contents of the four Prydain categories break the evident one-time design, whereby redirects are classed primarily by whether their targets are lists, or sections, or neither. Perhaps we once distinguished list entry targets from list page targets. I say one-time design because it is thoroughly broken in practice --see the actual scope of Fiction-based redirects to list entries-- and by some of the template messages --including some of your recent wordings, iirc.

See the category page Prydain redirects for more information about the contents --which, rather than the names discussed above (1a), is where I intended to break the design and hope to propose something. --P64 (talk) 18:12, 26 July 2015 (UTC)

Okay then! Thank you for your words, and I'm not surprised that there are things about these that are in a lot of need of fixing. You appear to be getting a good handle on it all, so I shall wait to see what develops. Thank you again, and let me know if I can be of any help to you. And just so you know, the semicolon usage renders invalid HTML5 unless used with colons, see H:DL. – Paine  02:14, 27 July 2015 (UTC)