Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Dungeons & Dragons

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WikiProject Dungeons & Dragons (Rated Project-class)
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D&D to-do:

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:

So, what is left?Edit

(Courtesy pinging potentially interested editors: User:AugusteBlanqui, User:BD2412, User:Bilby, User:Casliber, User:Daranios, User:David Shepheard, User:Drilnoth, User:Frecklefoot, User:Guinness323, User:Hobit, User:J Milburn, User:Jclemens, User:Necrothesp, User:Newimpartial, User:Oknazevad, User:Peregrine Fisher, User:Sangrolu, User:Sariel Xilo, User:Shadzar, User:Torchiest, User:Toughpigs, User:Vulcan's Forge, User:Webwarlock)

Well, aside from our many articles about game supplements, adventure modules, video games, game designers, and much more?  ;)

If you have been living under a rock for the last several months, you may have missed that our project's selection of articles on fictional elements has dropped dramatically. In some cases we were talking about things so minor that it is unlikely that even one single independent reliable source has ever or will ever exist for it. In some cases, we are talking about things that one might presume a case for notability could be made, but were still deleted or redirected (see *Wikipedia:WikiProject Dungeons & Dragons/Where#Is a deleted article always gone forever? for a selection of topics which may have potential for the future; see *Wikipedia:WikiProject Dungeons & Dragons/Article alerts/Archive for the full list of deletions going back to 2010), but in some cases an article survived an AFD either by the skin of its teeth, or by legitimate improvement through addition of independent reliable sources.

That leaves us with the question of what is left, and what can be done for them. The momentum on deletion efforts slowed down considerably in March 2020, presumably because there was not much left to delete. In the process of working on all those AFDs, some people were able to identify a few independent reliable sources that can be used for monsters and other fictional elements; it might be a good idea to see what other surviving articles those can be applied to, or what sources can be found for other fictional element articles. Since we already have people looking at what to get rid of, I figured it would be a good idea to explore what we have left to see what we can still keep. Some of these have survived AFD so far, while others have not been nominated yet and may still be, although I could have missed some:

List of surviving articles about fictional elements


Character classes:

Gameplay concepts:



Fictional elements miscellany:

On the one hand, that is still a big list. On the other hand, it is a small fraction of what once was – probably not even 10% of the fictional element articles we had a year ago. So pick something, anything – add it to your watchlist if you think it might be vulnerable, add any sources you can find anywhere, or just cross your fingers and hope for the best. Some of these will probably survive (another) AFD, some will be deleted, some will be merged. It is debatable as to whether or not having fewer articles is an objectively "good" thing, but having fewer articles does at least make them more manageable, so I think we can set more reasonable expectations for looking at what we can actually improve from what is left. BOZ (talk) 22:26, 2 April 2020 (UTC)

The tidal mark/truce point at AfD is >2 significant mentions in secondary sources, so that is what has to be aimed for for any article to be 'safe' and even then depends on who turns up to an AfD. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 23:48, 2 April 2020 (UTC)
At Talk:List of Advanced Dungeons & Dragons 2nd edition monsters, where my main efforts lie, I started a list of secondary sources. They are very much with regard to monsters, but some of the sources definitely have content on other topics, too. Daranios (talk) 07:24, 3 April 2020 (UTC)
Thanks for this Boz. I'm going to pick a couple and start working on them. I'll put my name next to them on this list. Also, will be interesting to see if the deletionists use your list to target additional articles they 'missed' going through the categories. AugusteBlanqui (talk) 08:32, 3 April 2020 (UTC)
I imagine they will, but in life sometimes you need to take risks. I'm hoping that this will lead to more good work than anything else, so thank you for any efforts you can contribute. :) BOZ (talk) 12:07, 3 April 2020 (UTC)
And, our first round has started. ;) Glabrezu is pretty minor, but Lolth, Asmodeus, and Kobold may have potential that the nominator (as usual) has undoubtedly overlooked. BOZ (talk) 12:46, 18 April 2020 (UTC)
One more for now, the Lich, same as those mentioned above. BOZ (talk) 05:36, 20 April 2020 (UTC)
Current AFDs include Bulette, Epic level, List of prestige classes, and List of alternative Dungeons & Dragons classes. BOZ (talk) 12:19, 4 May 2020 (UTC)
Add to that, List of human deities in Dungeons & Dragons, and List of Dungeons & Dragons deities. BOZ (talk) 12:33, 6 May 2020 (UTC)
Cataclysm (Dragonlance) is now at AFD. BOZ (talk) 12:24, 23 May 2020 (UTC)
The Sundering is now at AFD. BOZ (talk) 22:04, 29 June 2020 (UTC)
Bag of holding was sent to AFD a few days ago, now Portable hole just today. BOZ (talk) 14:27, 2 July 2020 (UTC)
War of the Lance is now on its 3rd AFD. BOZ (talk) 04:44, 8 July 2020 (UTC)
I redirected Helm (Forgotten Realms) and Selûne rather than being deleted by PROD. AugusteBlanqui, you can always restore later if you had more sources to improve it. BOZ (talk) 21:47, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
Savage Coast is up for AFD. BOZ (talk) 05:30, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
Mordenkainen is at AFD; I believe he at least likely gets some coverage in Designers & Dragons which I have, so I will check that later today. BOZ (talk) 12:32, 14 September 2020 (UTC)
World of Eberron is at AFD now. BOZ (talk) 20:12, 24 September 2020 (UTC)
One more, List of Dragonlance artifacts. BOZ (talk) 00:09, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
Kender (Dragonlance) is up for merge, Khelben "Blackstaff" Arunsun and Elaith Craulnober are up for PROD. BOZ (talk) 12:30, 28 September 2020 (UTC)
List of Dragonlance creatures is now also at AFD. BOZ (talk) 19:39, 1 October 2020 (UTC)
Time of Troubles is now at AFD. BOZ (talk) 19:50, 22 November 2020 (UTC)
Neverwinter and Waterdeep are both at AFD. Happy Thanksgiving! BOZ (talk) 06:06, 27 November 2020 (UTC)
Kara-Tur is also at AFD. BOZ (talk) 05:43, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
Wulfgar is up for his third AFD, and Tiamat is also up - those seem like good potential candidates to have additional sources. BOZ (talk) 22:09, 11 January 2021 (UTC)
And, I was right! :) Both were closed as Keep. BOZ (talk) 13:34, 19 January 2021 (UTC)
Jarlaxle is now up for his third try as well, but I think he may be more along the lines of the last two. BOZ (talk) 13:17, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
Erevis Cale is up for his second AFD. BOZ (talk) 03:36, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
Circle of Eight is at AFD. BOZ (talk) 18:31, 20 April 2021 (UTC)
Nothing for a few months, but now the Troll article is at AFD. BOZ (talk) 22:11, 9 August 2021 (UTC)
Ravenloft domains is up for AFD. BOZ (talk) 12:17, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Well, just a suggestion, if anyone is so inclined (not me for a long time yet ;-), for articles that need improvement which I would hate to see go: The List of Dungeons & Dragons deities and related lists. They might be helped with content from Religions in play: games, rituals, and virtual worlds and other secondary sources brought up at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Outer Plane. These could of course also help Outer Plane and Plane (Dungeons & Dragons). Also great, but a lot of work would be a parent article Religion in Dungeons & Dragons or some such, based on the same sources and possibly benefiting from stuff found in Dungeons & Dragons controversies with the allegations of satanism, demon worship, promoting paganism... Daranios (talk) 10:22, 9 April 2020 (UTC)

Well since Illithid/Mind-Flayer, and Beholder are trademarked to HASBRO/WotC that should give them some notoriety by legal precedent? shadzar-talk 15:09, 15 April 2020 (UTC)
I would be inclined to think that, at least, it couldn't hurt. :) BOZ (talk) 18:07, 15 April 2020 (UTC)

Is there actually any place within the now-existing articles where D&D's experience points are discussed? Mizer, Nicholas J. Tabletop role-playing games and the experience of imagined worlds. Cham, Switzerland. ISBN 978-3-030-29127-3. OCLC 1129162802. on pages 33-34 has a very much non-plot discussion about them, linking getting EP for gold in the original edition with Protestant work ethic, but I would not know where to include that. Also, on pages 31-32 there is a discussion about the importance of the concept of the adventurer for the game and its appeal, should anyone want to go into that. Daranios (talk) 10:56, 8 September 2020 (UTC)

Well, there is Experience point. :) BOZ (talk) 12:33, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
True, but surprisingly that article does not seem to say anywhere what one get's experience points for! And I did not want to go in so deep as to create such a section :-). Daranios (talk) 15:07, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
Ah, looking again it does so shortly in the very beginning. But that again is too prominent a place to add that bit from Mizer/Peterson :-). Daranios (talk) 15:09, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
This thesis should be another great secondary source for a number of D&D topics. Daranios (talk) 10:51, 21 September 2020 (UTC)
You have been doing excellent work on finding additional sources for D&D topics for the last few months - thank you! :) BOZ (talk) 12:26, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

Just wanted to say that after the release of Van Richten's Guide to Ravenloft, I believed we had enough material to restore the articles on Darklord (Ravenloft), Ravenloft domains, and Vistani... so I did. :) BOZ (talk) 03:15, 12 June 2021 (UTC)

Link to discussion about possible move of RPGAEdit

I'll keep discussion at that location, but thought members of this project might have useful input. For the record, no move has yet been requested. BusterD (talk) 21:37, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

Most viewed stub in this WikiprojectEdit

The Legend of Drizzt 20,415 680 Stub--Coin945 (talk) 14:20, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

I upgraded this one to Start, as it is clearly not a stub anymore. 2601:243:1C80:6740:52F:C87D:7250:594A (talk) 15:37, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

Help from The Monsters Know What They're DoingEdit

Hello everyone! Can anyone perhaps help me out with information on The Monsters Know What They're Doing by Keith Ammann? Does anyone know if the book is identical with the entries from Ammann's blog (Google books allows me glimpses only)? Specifically, I am wondering about Genies in popular culture. I've used the blog entries for marids and dao there to give the creative origins, and now I am wondering if the book says the same. The book would of course be much more well-thought-of as a secondary source as compared to a blog. Thanks a lot for any input! Daranios (talk) 15:09, 10 June 2021 (UTC)

Nice! :) I hope you are able to get those... I really admire the work you have done on what is left of the D&D monster coverage here. BOZ (talk) 20:38, 10 June 2021 (UTC)
Can confirm that the printed book has excellent material on Marids (pages 490-492) and Dao (page 492-493). I did a quick comparison and the print book version is slightly improved, copy-edited version of blog post: excellent information etymology and mythology. AugusteBlanqui (talk) 21:21, 10 June 2021 (UTC)
Perfect, than I will change the citation from the blogs to the book. Thank you very much for checking, AugusteBlanqui! Daranios (talk) 14:16, 11 June 2021 (UTC)
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