Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Tree swallow/archive1

The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Ian Rose via FACBot (talk) 10:14, 12 August 2018 [1].


Tree swallowEdit

Nominator(s): RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:08, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

This article is about an American swallow in the genus Tachycineta. There has been a lot of research done on it (at least compared to most of the other birds I have worked on), with some even considering it a model organism. It's as comprehensive as I can get it, so I believe it is ready to be a featured article. Thanks! RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:08, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

Image review

  • File:Tree_Swallow-rangemap.gif: what is the source of the data presented in this map? Nikkimaria (talk) 00:42, 2 July 2018 (UTC)
It looks to be from the HBW range map. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 01:52, 2 July 2018 (UTC)
@Nikkimaria: Any further comments? RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 15:25, 24 July 2018 (UTC)
Just that the source link for the image is dead, so a good data source should be added. Nikkimaria (talk) 00:12, 25 July 2018 (UTC)
@Nikkimaria: Ok, I changed the source to HBW. Thanks! RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 17:30, 25 July 2018 (UTC)

From FunkMonkEdit

  • I'll review soon. As usual, I have some media suggestions first. FunkMonk (talk) 21:47, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
  • That picture of a box nest isn't very interesting. How about one of these[2][3], of natural nests in trees, or this one[4] of a chick being fed in a box nest?
Nice! I replaced the picture of the nest box with the first photo, and added the last one to the feeding section. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 23:41, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
This image of a bird feeding three chicks might be even better than the one I linked earlier:[5] FunkMonk (talk) 01:52, 10 July 2018 (UTC)
  • We have some audio files, if one of them is good, might be useful:[6]
I added one of the files. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 23:41, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
  • This photo shows the egg well, could be cropped and used:[7]
Added. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 23:41, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
  • This image show fighting, might be interesting:[8]
Added! RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 23:41, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Perhaps this image shows a mating pair better than the one used:[9]
I think that the one currently in the article is better, just in terms of image quality. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 23:41, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
  • The intro seems a bit oog comparedf to the length of the article.
I tried to trim it down a bit; I'm going to keep the section on breeding and stuff the same because of the fact that the stuff about that is a major area of research about this bird.
  • "This swallow is sometimes placed in the genus Iridoprocne" Accoridng to who and why?
Found out why. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 21:58, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "of its short coalescence time" Which is what?
I added an explanation, but its pretty long; what are your thoughts on it. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 21:58, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "is only inherited from one source" Too vague, you could specify it is from the maternal line.
Specified.
  • "A study based on such nuclear DNA" Again also vague, explain why this is better?
I already explained it in the previous sentence. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 21:58, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
  • It seems odd that you jump from naming to systematics, and then back to the meaning of the names you mentioned first. This could be organised better if you group the related info.
Fixed. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 22:20, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Give authorities to the synonyms in the taxobox.
Added. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 22:20, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "This swallow" It seems odd that you only link the term down in description, instead of the former section. Also, it is best to refer to the subject wit its full name at the start of a section.
Corrected. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 22:20, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "and the tarsi are pale brown" So what colour are the rest of the legs? Or does this perhaps apply to the whole limb? If so, could be specified.
Changed to "legs and feet". RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 22:20, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
  • You say the wings are blackish, but it seems the wing coverts are also blue?
I'm assuming that means the primaries and such are blackish, but the sources that I have don't say this. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "aspects of this organism's biology" Seems very unspecific and detached, why not just use its name or say "bird's"? Also, what is a model organism?
Changed to "bird's". I don't really think that I'll explain what a model organism is; I feel like most people know what it is, and I linked it anyways. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 05:31, 8 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "Although it is aggressive during the breeding season, the tree swallow is sociable outside of the breeding season" Unnecessary repetition.
Fixed. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 05:31, 8 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "about 28% of breeders disperse after" If this is only a percentage of a percentage, you shoudl say something like "of those breeders that disperse, 28% do so because they fail to etc."
Changed. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 05:31, 8 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Why is this in British English, if it primarily lived in the US? I see grey and metres. Or is it supposed to be Canadian English?
This is really just how I write... except for "metre". Anyways, I suppose you could interpret it as Canadian English. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 05:31, 8 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "and wing length of the female." Sounds odd, what's the correlation?
It allows it to forage more efficiently; added. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 05:31, 8 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "increased heterozygosity" Explain.
I feel like this is sort of explained by the next phrase, and I feel like this is common enough in genetics that it doesn't require an explanation; heck, I learned it in middle school. Also, explaining it with something like "(more different alleles)" would clash with the the next phrase. Furthermore, I linked it. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 05:31, 8 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "The sex ratio of the hatchlings is male biased in females of better condition" This is a bit confusing, you could make it clearer that the females mentioned here are their mothers.
Changed to "Nests produced by females of better condition often have sex ratios skewed towards high quality males." RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 22:07, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "in females of better condition, and these males produced by the females in better condition are themselves in better condition." You say "better condition" three times in a sentence, I think it could be simplified.
Removed repetition. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 22:07, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "The growth of nestling tree swallows is influenced their environment." Missing "by".
Fixed. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 22:07, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Predators other than snakes that eat chicks?
I looked for this, but I couldn't find much. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 22:07, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
I actually just happened on a paper that also said raccoons prey on chicks. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "but the authors of the study that found the correlations find this unlikely" Seems redundant.
I reworded the final part to "believed this", but they both have to be in there, because I haven't introduced the study itself yet. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "Instead, they advocated that it indicated that" Also seems unnecessarily long.
Changed to "they thought it showed that". RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "quality female is able to lay earlier due to that quality." Also doesn't sound very look so good. A lot of repetition in that entire paragraph of immunology.
I feel like this can't really be removed, because otherwise it wouldn't really by clear what "that" is. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "the reintroduction of beavers" How is this correlated?
I couldn't find the correlation. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "taken in the all four of the Northern Hemisphere" Unnecessary.
Fixed. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "In nests near lakes acidified by humans, calcium supplements... are more important in the diet of nestlings." What is the correlation?
Reworded, which actually happened to correct a tiny error in my understanding of the paper. In essence, calcium supplements are harder to find, forcing tree swallows to go further to go them, potentially exposing the nest to predators and such. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "according to nuclear DNA studies... according to mitochondrial DNA studies" I don't think this level of detail is needed in the intro. You could just say "depending on the method" or something.
Changed to "depending on the method". RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • " is a migratory bird" Is this really needed in the first sentence of the intro, when you explain it migrates in more detail furhter dow the paragrapgh?
I'd say so, because it is a basic fact about the bird; I also say its found in North America, but I describe its distribution there in further detail later on in the lead. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "extra-pair paternity puzzling." Seems too informal.
I'd disagree about it's informality, and it sounds better than the alternative, "confusing", at least to my mind. You can change it if you'd like though. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "hese do no significantly affect breeding" Not?
Fixed RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "but, on nestlings, these do no significantly affect breeding" This seems oddly worded, as if it is the nestlings that are breeding.
Changed to "these do little damage". RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • "This swallow is vulnerable" Again, seems odd that swallow would be linked all the way down in the third paragraph of the intro.
It's actually the first occurrence of it in the lead. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 20:46, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Support - this looks to be in good shape to me now. FunkMonk (talk) 01:45, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

Comments Support by Cas LiberEdit

Taking a look now...

...is a migratory bird found in North America in the family Hirundinidae. - the construction sounds odd to me, but I concede that it is ambiguous if the family comes before "North America" (so not a deal-breaker). In any case, I would make it of the family... rather than "in"...
Changed. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 02:00, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
the eyes are a dark brown - any reason why "a" is here?
Nope; removed. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 02:00, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
why are first year females and not first year males mentioned in lead?
Because only first year females can be distinguished on the basis of plumage. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 02:00, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
ok fair enough Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 06:19, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
The tree swallow is found in North America, where it breeds in the US and Canada. - you've already mentioned it is found in North America in the first sentence - I'd remove that and give more exactness to the range.
I removed the second mention, and I changed the first sentence to say "Americas", since it can be found to winter in South America.
The tree swallow nests either by itself - err, not in pairs?
Changed. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 02:00, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
can we link "acidified lakes" to somewhere?
Yeah; linked. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 02:00, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
I think as Polygynous means "mating with more than one female", I think using plain words is better than a jargony one. But agree that shoehorning in the meaning could make the sentence repetitive...
I personally think that most people know what polygyny is, so I won't do this. I will put it in parentheses if you insist, but I think that it is obvious from context; I already say how breeding males are polygynous, so I don't think there is much room for confusion. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 02:00, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
ok point taken/I'll pay that. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 06:19, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
The fact that it is able to habitate open areas - "habitate"?? surely there is a plainer word...
Changed to "live in" (it's going to be mainstream soon, just you watch!). RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 02:00, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
The tree swallow usually renests in the same area to breed again - "nests" is fine, "renests" unnecessary
Changed. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 02:00, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
link territory, tree limit, antigen and hypothermia
Done. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 02:00, 20 July 2018 (UTC)
Nests produced by females of better condition often have sex ratios skewed towards high quality males. - errr, what's a high quality male?
I'll change it to "males of good condition"; it had originally been "males of better condition", but I think that what I have now changed it to is a good replacement (at least for the purposes of the article). RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 02:00, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

more later - need to sleep now Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:19, 19 July 2018 (UTC) provisionally looks ok otherwise. Will look more later. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 21:12, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

Ok all looks pretty good on prose and comphrehensiveness-wise Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 06:19, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

Support Comments from JimEdit

No major issues, but some nitpicks Jimfbleak - talk to me? 13:17, 21 July 2018 (UTC)

  • Tachycineta, where it is depending on the method, either basal to the whole genus, or basal just to a clade consisting of the violet-green, golden, and Bahama swallow. —is this necessary in the lead? It's technical stuff that's off-putting to the casual reader.
I changed it to "where its phylogenetic placement is in debate." RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 15:22, 21 July 2018 (UTC)
  • grey-brown washed breastgrey-brown-washed breast.
Changed. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 15:22, 21 July 2018 (UTC)
  • The tree swallow nests either in pairs or loose groups—It always nests in pairs, better "isolated pairs" or something similar.
Changed to "isolated pairs". RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 15:22, 21 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Monogamous; Long Island, New York; exoskeleton—link at first occurence.
Done; but I linked "socially monogamous" instead of "monogamous". RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 15:22, 21 July 2018 (UTC)
  • tree swallow forages both by itself…forages alone…
Done. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 15:22, 21 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Migratory Bird Treaty Act of 1918. —(in lead as well). This is very parochial. The US legislation is an implementation of the Migratory Bird Treaty between the US and Canada, but the Canadian implementation, the Migratory Birds Convention Act, isn't even mentioned.
Nice catch. Added to both lead and status section. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 15:22, 21 July 2018 (UTC)
  • The tree swallow forages 0 to 50 metres (160 ft) above the ground forages up to 50 metres(160 ft) above the ground seems more natural
Done. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 15:22, 21 July 2018 (UTC)
  • In the tree swallow, some components of the immune system deteriorate with age. —Is this typical of all swallows? All birds? All vertebrates?
Well, I think that some components of the immune system deteriorating instead of others is relatively common throughout the animals, but it seems that other passerines recently studied displayed deterioration of acquired humoral immunity, contrasting with tree swallows. I put the sentence "The lack of deterioration in the former contrasts with some other studies of passerines" into the article. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 15:22, 21 July 2018 (UTC)
No other queries, changed to support above Jimfbleak - talk to me? 06:08, 22 July 2018 (UTC)

Coord noteEdit

Source review, anyone? Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 06:08, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

Ok will take a look at sourcing/formatting Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 01:48, 6 August 2018 (UTC)
Thank you! RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 10:57, 6 August 2018 (UTC)
Done. RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 10:57, 6 August 2018 (UTC)
  • refs all formatted consistently
  • Earwigs is clear
  • In FN 1, I dunno where the range of 834000 km2 is.
It's under "Geographic Range". RileyBugz私に叫ぼう私の編集 10:57, 6 August 2018 (UTC)
Gosh, how'd I miss that?? ok cool....Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:52, 6 August 2018 (UTC)
  • FN 6, used once, material in source
  • FN 17, used once, material in source
  • FN 43, used twice, material in source

Ok - spot check ok. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:52, 6 August 2018 (UTC)

Tks Cas -- are you happy to sign off on the quality/reliability of the sources used? Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 23:14, 6 August 2018 (UTC)
Yes. sources are reliable Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:15, 7 August 2018 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.