The previous Masters pages included a weather section for each day of the tournament. Johnsmith2116 (talk) 13:19, 7 April 2022 (UTC)

That one did but most don't have it. Not sure why it can't be added to the daily summaries, if there's anything interesting to say Nigej (talk) 13:26, 7 April 2022 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Baltic Pipeline System-II full/docEdit

 Template:Baltic Pipeline System-II full/doc has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the entry on the Templates for discussion page. WikiCleanerMan (talk) 20:13, 16 April 2022 (UTC)

ITN recognition for Jack NewtonEdit

 On 21 April 2022, In the news was updated with an item that involved the article Jack Newton, which you updated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page. SpencerT•C 03:38, 21 April 2022 (UTC)

Olympic databaseEdit

Regarding this edit: did you mean to say "However it has not given me any confidence..."? isaacl (talk) 20:29, 10 May 2022 (UTC)

succession boxesEdit

I was wondering your reason for removing the succession boxes from the 4 golf majors? Thank you Tomrtn (talk) 22:57, 13 May 2022 (UTC)

See WT:GOLF#Succession boxes in major championships. As noted there, the auto-expanded navbox seems to me a better way forward. Nigej (talk) 05:18, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

New Page Patrol newsletter May 2022Edit

New Page Review queue March 2022

Hello Nigej,

At the time of the last newsletter (No.26, September 2021), the backlog was 'only' just over 6,000 articles. In the past six months, the backlog has reached nearly 16,000, a staggering level not seen in several years. A very small number of users had been doing the vast majority of the reviews. Due to "burn-out", we have recently lost most of this effort. Furthermore, several reviewers have been stripped of the user right for abuse of privilege and the articles they patrolled were put back in the queue.

Several discussions on the state of the process have taken place on the talk page, but there has been no action to make any changes. The project also lacks coordination since the "position" is vacant.

In the last 30 days, only 100 reviewers have made more than 8 patrols and only 50 have averaged one review a day. There are currently 728 New Page Reviewers, but about a third have not had any activity in the past month. All 1032 administrators have this permission, but only about a dozen significantly contribute to NPP.

This means we have an active pool of about 450 to address the backlog. We cannot rely on a few to do most of the work as that inevitably leads to burnout. A fairly experienced reviewer can usually do a review in a few minutes. If every active reviewer would patrol just one article per day, the backlog would very quickly disappear.

If you have noticed a user with a good understanding of Wikipedia notability and deletion, do suggest they help the effort by placing {{subst:NPR invite}} on their talk page.

If you are no longer very active on Wikipedia or you no longer wish to be part of the New Page Reviewer user group, please consider asking any admin to remove you from the list. This will enable NPP to have a better overview of its performance and what improvements need to be made to the process and its software.

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Sent 05:18, 23 May 2022 (UTC)

Cup eventsEdit

As you've probably seen, I recently created a page for Vic Bennetts. He won a number of "cup" events during his amateur career. Some examples are here and here. I wasn't sure whether they are worthy of inclusion in the "Amateur Wins" section. I'll definitely keep them in the prose but I'm not sure if they meet our standards otherwise. They may be along the level of schoolboys championships. If you have the time, please briefly let me know your thoughts.


Oogglywoogly (talk) 07:39, 8 June 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

I don't know anything about these events, but my general view would be that 1 round event shouldn't be included. All pros won large numbers of amateur events in their early careers and our list of wins needs to concentrate on the most important. Nigej (talk) 05:16, 9 June 2022 (UTC)
Ok thanks. I have deleted them from the Amateur wins sections.
Oogglywoogly (talk) 22:03, 9 June 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

Australian Men's Interstate Teams MatchesEdit

I am almost done harassing you about Vic Bennetts. On your Australian Men's Interstate Teams Matches page, under the Appearances section, I noticed that you only have Bennetts playing in the matches from 1963 to 1966. However, I have links stating he participated in the 1962 and 1967 events. In 1962 article, it says he was selected for the "junior" team. Perhaps that is a different category? For the 1967 article, however, it says he was selected for the "senior" team - not sure what was going on with that but maybe he just selected to drop out later on? Any help would be much appreciated.

Thanks, Oogglywoogly (talk) 15:14, 11 June 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

I think the 1962 event would be the boys event. which seems to have started in 1958, but I don't know any details about this event. The 1967 mens interstate matches were held in September. The matches referred to in your link (in February) were, it seems, junior v senior practice matches and he wasn't selected for the interstate event: Nigej (talk) 15:36, 11 June 2022 (UTC)
For Junior interstate see: for 1962. Played in 1961 too: but not in 1960 Also played in the junior event in 1963: and 1964 and 1965 Nigej (talk) 17:21, 11 June 2022 (UTC)
Thank you so much for your hard work. I have added all of the relevant information to his Team Appearances section. I noticed that there is a large overlap between his participation in the junior and senior events - just wondering but do you know why? I assumed they'd be mutually exclusive categories.
I have also noted all of the team events he appeared in the Team Appearances section. I think this may be too promiscuous, however, as a number of these events seem quite small. (The senior interstate tournament is the only one I heard of before I started his page.) For the Amateur wins and Professional wins categories we have have decided not all victories are worthy of inclusion (i.e. pro-am wins, schoolboy championships). Likewise, do we have criteria established to determine whether certain team events are notable enough?
Oogglywoogly (talk) 19:35, 12 June 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly
The junior level in Australia in his day was under-21, later changed to under-18. It did mean that useful juniors could play in both. Didn't seem to be anything to stop it. Similar thing happened in the UK. There used to be a "youth" level, under-23, but at some point all the top amateurs were youths, so The R&A abandoned the "youth" level to concentrate on the boys age group (roughly under-18). Makes more sense nowadays. Nigej (talk) 19:49, 12 June 2022 (UTC)
Thanks for the clarification about the amateur categories. More importantly, do you known anything about notability criteria for the Team Appearances section?
Oogglywoogly (talk) 23:02, 12 June 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly
Not sure there's any rules about the Team Appearances section. I guess anything that got significant coverage could be added but, personally, I wouldn't add minor amateur events. Nigej (talk) 06:06, 13 June 2022 (UTC)

New Page Patrol newsletter June 2022Edit

New Page Review queue June 2022

Hello Nigej,

Backlog status

At the time of the last newsletter (No.27, May 2022), the backlog was approaching 16,000, having shot up rapidly from 6,000 over the prior two months. The attention the newsletter brought to the backlog sparked a flurry of activity. There was new discussion on process improvements, efforts to invite new editors to participate in NPP increased and more editors requested the NPP user right so they could help, and most importantly, the number of reviews picked up and the backlog decreased, dipping below 14,000[a] at the end of May.

Since then, the news has not been so good. The backlog is basically flat, hovering around 14,200. I wish I could report the number of reviews done and the number of new articles added to the queue. But the available statistics we have are woefully inadequate. The only real number we have is the net queue size.[b]

In the last 30 days, the top 100 reviewers have all made more than 16 patrols (up from 8 last month), and about 70 have averaged one review a day (up from 50 last month).

While there are more people doing more reviews, many of the ~730 with the NPP right are doing little. Most of the reviews are being done by the top 50 or 100 reviewers. They need your help. We appreciate every review done, but please aim to do one a day (on average, or 30 a month).

Backlog drive

A backlog reduction drive, coordinated by buidhe and Zippybonzo, will be held from July 1 to July 31. Sign up here.   Barnstars will be awarded.

TIP – New school articles

Many new articles on schools are being created by new users in developing and/or non-English-speaking countries. The authors are probably not even aware of Wikipedia's projects and policy pages. WP:WPSCH/AG has some excellent advice and resources specifically written for these users. Reviewers could consider providing such first-time article creators with a link to it while also mentioning that not all schools pass the GNG and that elementary schools are almost certainly not notable.


There is a new template available, {{NPP backlog}}, to show the current backlog. You can place it on your user or talk page as a reminder:

High unreviewed pages backlog: 6844 pages according to DatBot as of 04:00, 26 September 2022 (UTC)

There has been significant discussion at WP:VPP recently on NPP-related matters (Draftification, Deletion, Notability, Verifiability, Burden). Proposals that would somewhat ease the burden on NPP aren't gaining much traction, although there are suggestions that the role of NPP be fundamentally changed to focus only on major CSD-type issues.

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  1. ^ not including another ~6,000 redirects
  2. ^ The number of weekly reviews reported in the NPP feed includes redirects, which are not included in the backlog we primarily track.

MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 10:01, 24 June 2022 (UTC)

1963 Australian CupEdit

One last thing about Bennetts. I have this link where he and his partner tied for the lead at the Australian Cup at the end of regulation. In the link they say the teams were going to play an 18 hole playoff the next week on December 22. I have scoured the newspaper search engines and found nothing. In addition, I checked the December 23 edition of the Sydney Morning Herald on Google News Archive and found no reportage of this event. (I also checked the Age and found nothing.) Not sure if you know anything of this alleged playoff.

Oogglywoogly (talk) 18:19, 24 June 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

Like you, I can't find any record of the playoff. Nigej (talk) 05:02, 26 June 2022 (UTC)
Ok thanks.
Oogglywoogly (talk) 15:57, 27 June 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

Northern ProfessionalEdit

Hi there. FYI, I've been sandboxing the results and clipped many sources. See User:Wjemather/British PGA circuit#Northern Professional Championship. wjematherplease leave a message... 16:52, 28 June 2022 (UTC) .

Yes, needs sorting out. Not always clear which events were Leeds Cup too. See: which has the honours board for the Leeds Cup. Some years missing 1950s to 1970s but I'm not 100% convinced that these weren't held. Nigej (talk) 18:55, 28 June 2022 (UTC)
@Wjemather: I'm still not 100% clear about the 1963 and 1964 Leeds Cup situation. The honours board has 1963 missing and Caygill winning it 1964. Most plausibly this was his win (which you found before) in the "new 36-hole tournament" at Manchester Golf Club ( which Caygill did win ( This was a new venture (involving some amateurs) and ran from 1964 to 1969 and sources are clear that from 1965 onwards the winner did receive the Leeds Cup. We also know from this that when the 1965 event was held Caygill was "the holder of the Leeds Cup", although annoyingly it doesn't actually say that he won it for his 1964 win in the same event. Confusingly this: from 1970 says that Muscroft "had previously won the trophy in 1962 and 1964", a statement that's difficult to square with what I've said above, and presumably relates to his NPC win in 1964. How Muscroft could have won the Leeds Cup in 1964 but Caygill be "the holder of the Leeds Cup" when it was contested in 1965 isn't clear. Nigej (talk) 14:04, 30 June 2022 (UTC)
I came across this which suggests the 1963 NPC (Caygill won) carried the Leeds Cup, but nothing to substantiate that. I'll look again when I have a bit of time. wjematherplease leave a message... 14:50, 30 June 2022 (UTC)
As for the NPC, I just have a couple of gaps to fill: 1977, 1983 and 1984 wjematherplease leave a message... 14:53, 30 June 2022 (UTC)

NPP July 2022 backlog drive is on!Edit

New Page Patrol | July 2022 Backlog Drive
  • On 1 July, a one-month backlog drive for New Page Patrol will begin.
  • Barnstars will be awarded based on the number of articles patrolled.
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(t · c) buidhe 20:26, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

Shennecossett Golf CourseEdit

I have spent the past few days adding a lot of information to the Shennecossett Golf Course page. I have noticed that the newspapers often refer to "Shennecossett Country Club" in my research rather than "Shennecossett Golf Course." They are probably referring to the same place and are simply making a little mistake. However, I wanted to consult with you before making more edits.

My misgivings basically revolve around the Connecticut Open (1910s event). (As full disclosure, I created that page.) In the course of my research for Shennecossett I noticed no mention of this early century Connecticut Open. For example, on the club's website, despite a comprehensive history section, there is nothing. In addition, in my research for the 1910s Connecticut Open they usually refer to "Shennecossett Country Club." Basically, I'm not sure if Shennecossett Golf Course and Shennecossett Country Club are different clubs. Any help would be much appreciated.

Oogglywoogly (talk) 01:57, 22 July 2022 (UTC)

They do seem to be the same club, as far as I can see. I suspect that it was called a country club until being taken over by the town. One of the scorecards here says country club and has the title "circa late 1960s". Nigej (talk) 06:55, 22 July 2022 (UTC)
Thank you very much. I seem to have overlooked the scorecard section earlier. Clearly the same club.
Oogglywoogly (talk) 20:33, 26 July 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

Nomination of List of Great Britain and Ireland PGA Cup golfers for deletionEdit

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article List of Great Britain and Ireland PGA Cup golfers is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of Great Britain and Ireland PGA Cup golfers until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article until the discussion has finished.

Oogglywoogly (talk) 02:55, 22 July 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

Ted WebberEdit

A Rhodesian golfer named Ted Webber won the South African Amateur Championship (golf) in 1977 and 1978. I suspect this is the same person as Teddy Webber who finished runner-up at the 1986 South African PGA Championship. If so we should keep the names consistent and probably the flags. Do you know if this is the same guy?


Oogglywoogly (talk) 04:07, 28 July 2022 (UTC)

Must be the same person.Teddy seems much more common, eg Played for Rhodesia as an amateur and seems to have genuinely been from there. Despite the flag on the ET website he competed as a Zimbabwean from 1986 to 1988. Not sure why he's got a South African flag. Probably all mixed up with the politics of the time. In the apartheid days it was sometimes easier to be a Rhodesian/Zimbabwean (but sometimes not) but later sometimes it became easier to be a South African. "Majors of Golf" has "Edward Arthur Webber" (played in the Open 1986, 1987, 1988, missed cut each time) as his full name which fits with Nigej (talk) 05:50, 28 July 2022 (UTC)
See also which says he won 4 times in South Africa. Nigej (talk) 06:45, 28 July 2022 (UTC)
Thank you for the response. Yeah it's definitely the same guy. And thank you for changing the flags on the tournament pages.
Oogglywoogly (talk) 19:11, 28 July 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

question about flags of Rhodesia/ZimbabweEdit

For Mark McNulty's win at the 1980 Malaysian Open there is this blue-ish flag with a the Union Jack in the corner. This flag also exist on the 1980 Asia Golf Circuit page. This appears to be similar to Rhodesia's national flag from 1964-68 (see Flags of Rhodesia). But clearly the dates don't match. (Meanwhile, under Flags of Zimbabwe they note the 1960s Rhodesian flag on the page but that's it.) I think it should probably change.

Oogglywoogly (talk) 19:23, 28 July 2022 (UTC)

I would think common sense would indicate that we use the flag of Zimbabwe here, enough though it only became Zimbabwe in April 1980. Using the Union Jack, per List of Rhodesian flags is surely just confusing. Nigej (talk) 12:56, 29 July 2022 (UTC)
If we are going to use the flag of the time, surely the UK one is correct (or possibly Zimbabwe Rhodesia, as that continued to be used unofficially), not that of Zimbabwe (or Rhodesia). I have updated it in the articles accordingly (i.e. UK). Any confusion is due to our use of flagicons without text, which has been touched on many times, but never addressed properly. wjematherplease leave a message... 15:03, 29 July 2022 (UTC)
I agree that the Zimbabwe Rhodesia flag would be a possible option. Nigej (talk) 15:07, 29 July 2022 (UTC)

New Page Patrol newsletter August 2022Edit

New Page Review queue August 2022

Hello Nigej,

Backlog status

After the last newsletter (No.28, June 2022), the backlog declined another 1,000 to 13,000 in the last week of June. Then the July backlog drive began, during which 9,900 articles were reviewed and the backlog fell by 4,500 to just under 8,500 (these numbers illustrate how many new articles regularly flow into the queue). Thanks go to the coordinators Buidhe and Zippybonzo, as well as all the nearly 100 participants. Congratulations to Dr vulpes who led with 880 points. See this page for further details.

Unfortunately, most of the decline happened in the first half of the month, and the backlog has already risen to 9,600. Understandably, it seems many backlog drive participants are taking a break from reviewing and unfortunately, we are not even keeping up with the inflow let alone driving it lower. We need the other 600 reviewers to do more! Please try to do at least one a day.

MB and Novem Linguae have taken on some of the coordination tasks. Please let them know if you are interested in helping out. MPGuy2824 will be handling recognition, and will be retroactively awarding the annual barnstars that have not been issued for a few years.
Open letter to the WMF
The Page Curation software needs urgent attention. There are dozens of bug fixes and enhancements that are stalled (listed at Suggested improvements). We have written a letter to be sent to the WMF and we encourage as many patrollers as possible to sign it here. We are also in negotiation with the Board of Trustees to press for assistance. Better software will make the active reviewers we have more productive.
TIP - Reviewing by subject
Reviewers who prefer to patrol new pages by their most familiar subjects can do so from the regularly updated sorted topic list.
New reviewers
The NPP School is being underused. The learning curve for NPP is quite steep, but a detailed and easy-to-read tutorial exists, and the Curation Tool's many features are fully described and illustrated on the updated page here.
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Delivered by: MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 21:24, 6 August 2022 (UTC)

NPP messageEdit

Hi Nigej,


For those who may have missed it in our last newsletter, here's a quick reminder to see the letter we have drafted, and if you support it, do please go ahead and sign it. If you already signed, thanks. Also, if you haven't noticed, the backlog has been trending up lately; all reviews are greatly appreciated.

To opt-out of future mailings, please remove yourself here.

MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 23:11, 20 August 2022 (UTC)

Question about sectionsEdit

I have some questions about the sections we use in the text. Firstly, I have a question about the Early life section. Before I used to include very early life stuff like where the golfer was born, family info, and some very early golf anecdotes. But lately I've been enfolding all high school stuff under Early life rather than including it under the Amateur career section. I usually begin the Amateur career section when the subject goes to college (or around the age of 18 if he doesn't). What are your thoughts?

In addition, I am almost done with the page of Jerry Stolhand and have some questions about how I should organize the page. Stolhand had an unusual career arc where he turned professional, then had his amateur career status re-instated, but then turned professional a second time. I've heard of a number of golfers that have regained their amateur status but none where the golfer turned pro again. I created an independent section for each era of Stolhand's career but wasn't sure if that was the way it should be done. Any help would be much appreciated.


Oogglywoogly (talk) 03:25, 9 September 2022 (UTC)

I don't think we need to be too worried about the sections, it will be different for each biography. See Help:Section but I'm not sure its much help. Allen John comes to mind as someone who's turned professional twice, but it is unusual. Nigej (talk) 08:21, 9 September 2022 (UTC)
Ok thanks. I will check the Help section when I have the opportunity to. Also, I actually just noticed that John Harris (golfer) and Joe Stansberry also had their professional status renewed. Maybe it's not as unusual as we think.
Oogglywoogly (talk) 15:44, 9 September 2022 (UTC)Oogglywooggly
I just went through the advice page you sent me pertaining to Sections. Thank you but likewise I didn't find it very helpful; it seemed to focus mainly on technical stuff, not content. I think I'll just keep Stolhand's page organized the way it is.
One last thing... Could we create a separate line on the infobox for those that regained amateur status? On the page of Allen John we have it noted but it's on the same line as "Turned professional." To me, it looks awkward and jumbled. In addition, for the rare player that turned pro a second time, it would be nice to have a separate line for that too.
Oogglywoogly (talk) 15:44, 14 September 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly
Could be done. I'll have a think about it Nigej (talk) 16:22, 14 September 2022 (UTC)
Ok, please think about it. I think it would be worthwhile and probably easy to do as relatively few guys have had their amateur status re-instated.
Just to put it out there I will list all of the guys I know who have had their amateur status re-instated. They are Nathaniel Crosby, Sandy Galbraith, Steve Melnyk, Dillard Pruitt, and Bob Lewis (golfer). In addition, the professional golfers John Harris (golfer), Joe Stansberry, David Eger, Allen John, and Jerry Stolhand all had their amateur status re-instated but then turned pro a second time.
Oogglywoogly (talk) 20:38, 15 September 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

Bobby Jones' professional careerEdit


You have mentioned in passing that Bobby Jones turned pro sometime in his career. On his infobox, however, it is not noted. I have scoured the internet for this information but all I have is this website which says he turned pro sometime in the early 1930s. Do you have any more evidence stating when he turned pro? I think this is important as all you hear is the media is "the lifelong amateur Bobby Jones," "the greatest golfer never to turn pro," etc. but never anything about his professional career.

Oogglywoogly (talk) 19:56, 15 September 2022 (UTC)

Seems that even at the time of his retirement in November 1930 he regarded his proposed future actions (like making a film) as against his amateur status: See eg when Lawson Little turned professional in 1936.: "he has decided to give up his amateur status and go in, with Bobby Jones, for the professional and business side of golf". I dont think he ever played for prize money, but there's more to amateur status than that. Even now, giving a golf lesson for money means you lose your amateur status and become a professional. Nigej (talk) 06:04, 16 September 2022 (UTC)
Worth noting that we have Charlie Yates as low amateur in 1934 at Masters Tournament#Low amateurs when he finished below Jones (297 to 294). Nigej (talk) 06:47, 16 September 2022 (UTC)
Ok, probably later tonight or tomorrow I will note the year Jones turned pro in the infobox and in the prose. Thank you for the links.
Oogglywoogly (talk) 16:03, 17 September 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly
I created a "Turned professional" subheading for Jones using some of the citations we referenced above. I also modified the infobox. If you can make any improvements, please do so.
Oogglywoogly (talk) 20:50, 20 September 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

Notability of winsEdit


I have one more thing about Jerry Stolhand. I have included just about every potentially notable event he won in his Amateur wins and Professional wins sections. However, some may be dubious. The most potentially dubious ones I have listed below.

  • As a 15-year-old-boy he won his town's local Jaycee event. I included it earlier but now that I think about it it probably isn't notable. In addition, he won a similar event in 1953. What do you think about these events?
  • In 1956, he won a professional-assistant tournament in Wichita, Kansas. I know we don't include pro-ams but maybe these pro-assistant events are big enough? This type of event includes two professionals whereas the pro-ams only have one.
  • In 1966, he won the "championship flight" of the Barber's Point Open. (The "championship flight" appears to be the title for the "amateur division" back then.) But he didn't win the tournament overall against the pros. He won a lot of these "championship flights." I think these amateur victories should definitely be mentioned in the prose but maybe not in the Wins sections.
  • In 1965 and 1968, Stolhand won the Kaneohe Bay Youth Activities Association tournaments. This looks to be a charity benefit event. Not sure what our rules are about including events like this in the Wins sections.

Any advice would be much appreciated. Thanks,

Oogglywoogly (talk) 15:41, 16 September 2022 (UTC)

Not sure I can give any useful advice. Probably I wouldn't have included any of them. Nigej (talk) 05:14, 18 September 2022 (UTC)
Ok, I decided to delete the two Jaycee events as we seem to have consensus that we don't include junior events in the Wins sections. With the other stuff, I decided to keep them, at least for now.
Oogglywoogly (talk) 20:10, 20 September 2022 (UTC)Oogglywoogly

October 2022 New Pages Patrol backlog driveEdit

New Page Patrol | October 2022 backlog drive
  • On 1 October, a one-month backlog drive for New Page Patrol will begin.
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(t · c) buidhe 21:17, 23 September 2022 (UTC)