Talk:Netherlands

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In addition to the military-section, please note that the KCT (Korps Commando Troepen, Elite force) is also banned for women.

Forget that, the ban has been removed.

WikiProjects and notice boardEdit

See also Wikipedia:Netherlands for information on Wikipedia activities related to the Netherlands.

NetherlandEdit

It should be noted that the Dutch officially refer to their country as Nederland, singular not plural; the plural refering to the wider historical region. In English this would simply be Netherland - Netherlands is bit like Englands, Scotlands or Irelands. Also, the article often refers to "The Netherlands" when simply Netherland would do - it is a problem Ukraine also suffered from. Are there actually any countries that are officially known as The [Country]? I've just looked it up, The Gambia and The Bahamas it seems. 86.140.22.216 (talk) 10:31, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

"Netherlands" is the common English name for the country and since it is plural, "the Netherlands" is used to make sensible sentences. Compare it with "the United States". Thayts ••• 11:07, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
Netherland is not a normal English word. It is even slightly more complicated: in UK English you prefer to use "the Netherlands" in US English "Netherlands". In addresses, both are good, depending on the language variant used. Wikipedia prefers "city, Netherlands" because the variant without "the" is also good in a variant of English. The "the" never has a capital letter, except at the beginning of a sentence. So this article is in UK English because it always uses "the" before "Netherlands". --Egel Reaction? 12:30, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
Americans say "the Netherlands" too, I don't think there is a difference between UK and US English there. Thayts ••• 13:10, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
Netherlands is official also in the "Netherlands". IP's suggestion is WP:OR. Also, in this respect there is no difference between US, AU, IE, NZ and UK English. It shouldn't surprise. It's all English. gidonb (talk) 04:51, 25 December 2018 (UTC)
The Netherlands Board of Tourism & Conventions (NBTC) is the English name of the organisation which promotes the Netherlands nationally and internationally. 'Netherland' is not used by the Dutch to represent the name of the country in English. The probable reason for the flurry of activity on the name is that the Dutch government has decided to no longer identify itself as Holland. It will now only its real name – the Netherlands. This will apply in all circumstances.--Dacramac (talk) 09:56, 24 October 2019 (UTC)
Does this decision have any practical implications or is it just a declaration? I'm asking since Holland was informal in English anyway. gidonb (talk) 04:52, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
Practically, it will change some adverts and maybe names of events sponsored by the Dutch government, and they may even go so far as to change the holland.com domain at some point. ghouston (talk) 01:16, 1 January 2020 (UTC)
ghouston, awesome thank you so much! Some advertisements and branding are close to nothing. Great that you spell this out! Holland was informal and remains informal. gidonb (talk) 00:49, 4 January 2020 (UTC)

External links that belong elsewhere or need labelingEdit

Since this article is about a country that is only within the Kingdom of the Netherlands and the latter is the national government, the external links section seems to have several links that don't belong in this article or, if this is where people would look for them, that should be annotated as being for the national government, not the country government per se. Nick Levinson (talk) 03:40, 14 April 2019 (UTC)

Can you specify the links or just remove them? gidonb (talk) 04:55, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

LimburgishEdit

In what way does the EU charter makes Limburgish official with the Netherlands? Roger 8 Roger (talk) 07:05, 8 October 2019 (UTC)

Roger 8 Roger, you may enjoy reading this article. gidonb (talk) 04:58, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for that link. I asked the question originally because I have seen the EU charter used elsewhere to claim a language has official status within a country. An example is Cornish within the UK. My view is that recognition of the EU charter does not grant official status on any language. All it does is show that the country concerns accepts that the Charter says that a specific language is either a minority language (ie spoken) or a regional language affecting a regions culture (ie spoken or not). This is not the same as conferring offial status on the language. I therefore think Limbugish should not be noted in the infobox as official whereas Friesian is officiaal because a Dutch law says in is, in Friesland. There has been a debate on the UK article about the official status, or otherwise, of various languages, which is still ongoing. I note in your link it says, half way down: "Although Limburgish has received legal recognition, the language does not have the same official status as Dutch. Limburgers cannot ask their regional government to use Limburgish as a language of government. All oral and written communications with the government must by law continue to be conducted in the Dutch language." I think this is agrees with my opinion. Roger 8 Roger (talk) 10:19, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

Correct! Limburgish was recognized as a regional language or a level 2 language. It provides fewer privileges than the main or level 1 languages. gidonb (talk) 13:31, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

HollandEdit

Every now and then, something like "also called Holland" is added to the first sentence of this article, which is often changed in wording time after time and eventually removed before popping up again. I think it's better to get to a consensus on if we want to have it and if yes, in which words.

Personally I don't really mind what it will be, but there is something to say for both. Officially, the country's name is not Holland. Strictly speaking, Holland is only a region in the Netherlands. Dutchmen from outside Holland also don't like this name for the country. However, fact is that in the English-speaking world (and also outside) the country is often called and known as Holland anyway and even the Dutch government is promoting it with that name. I think this usage should perhaps also be acknowledged in an encyclopedia like this.

So, do we want to keep it in and in what wording, or do we want to omit it? If it's kept, then we should have a reliable source for it or otherwise still remove it. Thayts ••• 21:55, 10 October 2019 (UTC)

The NL is often, not rarely, called Holland, even by the Dutch themselves. The answer then is simple - it should be noted somewhere in this article, logically at the start. The problem is not so much with the editors who want to insert the word Holland but with those pedantically correct editors who do not. A good comparison is with the UK-England debate: even though those within the UK who refer to the UK as England, has dwindled to a trickle over time, many outside the UK still regularly persist with this habit, the Dutch included. Roger 8 Roger (talk) 23:45, 10 October 2019 (UTC)
Yes, so I'd like to get to a consensus so that we can refer to this discussion later. Thayts ••• 07:48, 11 October 2019 (UTC)
"Holland" is predominantly used as a synonym of the "Netherlands" in Dutch. In English it is virtually always or plainly always a synonym of the "Netherlands" and it often is the first choice name. This is the English-language Wikipedia so I support putting it in the first phrase of the article and keeping it there. I suggest "The Netherlands, informally Holland, is a country in Western Europe." gidonb (talk) 20:13, 12 October 2019 (UTC)
User:Thayts and User:Roger 8 Roger, do you agree with this proposal? Anyone else? gidonb (talk) 16:53, 1 December 2019 (UTC)
  Agree Thayts ••• 17:03, 1 December 2019 (UTC)
  Agree Roger 8 Roger (talk) 20:15, 1 December 2019 (UTC)

I've added a reference to the phrase in the lead. Thayts ••• 21:13, 3 December 2019 (UTC)

Awesome, thank you! gidonb (talk) 19:17, 8 December 2019 (UTC)
  Agree FWIW, I agree with the rationale. The government may not use it anymore for tourism purposes, and the term is luckily obsolete in sports. Technically the term is incorrect and only refers to part o the country. However, this term is still in widespread (though informal) use, and as long as that the case, we should mention it... L.tak (talk) 18:09, 20 January 2020 (UTC)

King Willem-Alexander has been nominated for deletionEdit

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 02:40, 9 January 2020 (UTC)

Please add European to al EU Member states as Demonym(s)Edit

Please add and connect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizenship_of_the_European_Union to al EU member states as Demonym(s)

For Netherlands it would be Dutch, European For Germany it would be German, European etc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 185.54.182.6 (talk) 14:58, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

Euro English de facto a languages in European NetherlandsEdit

Most people in the Netherlands speak and use English as there daily language especially in Amsterdam, The Hague, and Rotterdam.

Please add English as de facto language and connect it to Euro English — Preceding unsigned comment added by 185.54.182.6 (talk) 15:00, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

onzin. L.tak (talk) 00:05, 1 February 2020 (UTC)
It is understandable that you get that impression. Many waiters at the tourist spots are foreign seasonal workers, who do not always speak Dutch. --Egel Reaction? 12:47, 1 February 2020 (UTC)
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