Talk:King cake

Queen Cake

'Queen cakes' are also a name for cupcakes (a less common name than 'fairy cakes' but still in popular parlance) in Ireland and (to a lesser extent, AFAIK) the UK. Maybe a brief mention of this somewhere in the article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.163.235.219 (talk) 18:09, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Photo

That's not a very good picture of a king cake, but I'm not entirely familiar with all of the rules. Is it alright to copy a picture that shows a bit more detail of the king cake from another source, since this isn't for profit or commercial use? --Tarranon 03:36, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

See Wikipedia:Copyrights and Wikipedia:Images. If you have a better photo you've taken and which you're willing to release under a free licence and upload to Wikipedia, doing so is very welcome. Do not take someone else's copyrighted work. Cheers, -- Infrogmation 04:07, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

In response to the request above, I have a taken a picture of a traditional King Cake delivered to me from my family in Louisiana. I have released this picture into the public domain to be used by anyone. If the image or description are inappropriate, please feel free to edit. Darjeelingtea (talk) 06:21, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

king cake

Sorry for the new topic, but I can't seem to find the edit button for the old one.

The "King Cake" game seems to be described correctly, but I understand that the game is frequently played with a small baby inside the cake and the game is called "Baby Cake".

<a grendel>

Jean-Baptiste Greuze and king cake?

I have relatives who are from various areas of Louisiana (including New Orleans), but I can't figure out for the life of me what Jean-Baptiste Greuze has to do with king cake. Can anyone enlighten me on this point, that is...in case I'm missing something? Otherwise, the image featuring this person is a poor choice for the king cake article since the mention of this person adds nothing to learning what king cake is and the tradition surrounding it. lwalt 14:30, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

The title of the painting in question, "le gateau de Rois," does indeed translate to the term King Cake. I supsect the other discussion poster's confusion is because the article you get when you follow the painter's link has nothing to do with the tradition. The subject matter is merely a family study in which a king cake must have been involved. The painter himself has no link to king cakes other than having painted a family life view of a family enjoying one.

There are various issues to address but they belong as side-bar discussion, so I won't attempt to edit the main article. You must remember that the "king cake" is a borrowed tradition. As is typical with borrowed traditions translated from royalty to common folk, some things get distorted in the translation. The New Orleans king cake is similar to the other items described in the article and probably derives from an incomplete understanding of the European tradition.

In form, the "original" king cake resembles the cake one would associate with a cinnamon roll and the poured sugar icing would also be similar. However, the original king cake doesn't always have cinnamon flavoring. As such, it is often quite bland, serving only as a support for the confectioner's sugar and sprinkles - the latter being crystalline sugar with purple, green, and deep yellow (gold) food coloring.

The more modern king cake includes various flavorings and variations such as cream or fruit fillings, various kinds of cake variations, and other embellishments (cinnamon, nuts, other toppings) to increase marketability. Before Hurricane Katrina, the king cake was a big part of any bakery's business. Post-Katrina, those bakeries still able to provide king cakes are doing very well with them because it provides New Orleanians with a link to the past and an escape from a dreary present.

The Doc Man 17:36, 23 February 2007 (UTC)The_Doc_Man

The practice itself is very current in many parts of Europe and was obviously borrowed. The "original" king cake probably doesn't exist, as you can see on the other related articles that they are various way to do it. However, all are related to the same feast and have little trinkets in them. Tazmaniacs 01:28, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

The original must have existed at some point, since the tradition is similar in most of europe...Estradin (talk) 10:00, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Candlemas party in Mexico with tamales?

That comment on the tamales in Mexico may be regional. We have to keep in mind that there are certain regions of Mexico where there is an overlapping of the Native and European cultures. In some regions, the European traditions are stronger; in others, the Native traditions are stronger.

I really think people need to refrain from making statements that are too general. In our tradition (Aguascalientes), the people who got the baby (or babies, sometimes there were three) that's in the cake, were to host parties. The first of these parties is held on February 2, the celebration of Candlemas. In my family, that party was usually a masquerade party (because this party marks the beginning of Carnival season). Now, if in some households they made tamales, that could be tied to the Native tradition of making offerings. In our region, I doubt that any family who just finished having a long tamal eating period (December 16 - January 6; and for some December 16 - February 2 [which marks the end of the Christmas period and you may see the Rosca tradition tied to the Nativity and the Jesus's presentation in the Altar, because that is the 40th day after his birth]) would be ready for more of them.

So, I agree that this needs a citation and there needs to be a more plural representation of the different regions of Mexico. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.147.236.194 (talk) 15:39, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

Merger proposal

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The result of this discussion was to merge French king cake into King cake Gandaliter (talk) 17:29, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

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The two articles, King cake and French king cake, are both very similar and could probably be merged into the French king cake section of the King cake article.Static Shakedown 01:03, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

• Agree. I see no need for a separate article. Infrogmation (talk) 02:27, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
• Merge Yes, French King Cake should be merged into this article. No reason for national fork. --Macrakis (talk) 02:41, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
• Merge Agree that French King Cake should be merged into this article.—Theo (Talk) 12:41, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

I agree there is no point of a separate slide —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.47.45.92 (talk) 18:25, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

• DISAGREE! They are different. Those from the south know this. 98.192.154.165 (talk) 21:36, 11 January 2011 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The Trinket

I have been told stories about poor Mexican familys, who cannot afford to have the party and make tamales on Candlemas, have been known to eat the trinket to avoid the obligation, thereby making the party choose various other methods to choose who would host the next party. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.80.10.96 (talk • contribs)

What happened in 1870?

The text mentions that before 1870 the "feve" was an actual bean, and since 1870 the "feve" is a porcelain or plastic figurine. This is a pretty specific date, which suggests it wasn't a gradual change but maybe due to a law or formal requirement. Does anyone know what happened in 1870? --ESP (talk) 19:00, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Folklore vs. History

This article is incredibly mangled with legends originating in the city of New Orleans. The actual history of the King Cake tradition is buried in the article in a fashion that apparently attempts to conceal the pagan origins of the thing but it's really pretty simple: New Orleans got it from France; France got it from Rome; Rome used them to randomly choose a king of the Saturnalian festival with a bean hidden in a cake. The article as it stands feigns a pretense that the French tradition is somehow parallel to and distinct from the New Orleans tradition with the squirrely phrase "related culinary traditions." Good grief. I don't have the time or energy to try to straighten out this mess but the revisionist history doesn't serve the purpose of Wikipedia and doesn't really belong here other than in a "local traditions and legends" subsection or some such. Economy1 (talk) 13:28, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

Agree. This article does not treat the 'king cake' as a general culinary/festive tradition of which the New Orleans version is one variation, it takes the New Orleans version as the defining version (the second para describing what the cake is like 'now' describes the New Orleans version) and the rest as offshoots/backstory. If the New Orleans king cake somehow stands above and apart from all the other living king cake traditions, then it should have its own article. If not, it should be a section of this article rather than being its overwhelming bias.Faff296 (talk) 00:32, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

Colours

The gold, purple and green actually symbolize gold, frankincense and myrrh, the three gifts brought by the Kings at Epiphany. I dont know where one would find citation for this. I know because I lived in an area from my childhood where this is celebrated . — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.2.205.240 (talk) 20:16, 12 January 2018 (UTC)

One reason you would need a cite for it, is the current colors have a great many sources which back it up:

• http://www.neworleansshowcase.com/hisofkincak.html#.WlkbGqinEpQ
• http://www.mardigrasneworleans.com/mgcolors.html
• https://www.southernliving.com/mardi-gras/king-cake-meaning
• http://www.allaboutmardigras.com/Features/Tradition%20Features/colors.html
• https://www.bustle.com/articles/140663-what-do-each-of-the-mardi-gras-colors-mean-heres-why-you-see-so-much-green

I did not cherry-pick this list, but just googled, "king cake colors", and Ctrl+Fed on each page for "represent" and it was unanimous in this small sample size that what the colors traditionally represented in the cake are the same as what's listed on the page. Anything else is just "Original Research" which is not permissible on Wikipedia, even if you honestly think it's true, we'd need evidence. JesseRafe (talk) 20:37, 12 January 2018 (UTC)

Merge variants

Bolo-rei, Rosca de reyes and Tortell are all regional variants of King cake, which are best discussed in one place. This proposal arises from earlier discussion at Talk:Tortell#Merger proposal. Klbrain (talk) 06:09, 17 September 2019 (UTC)

Agreed Merge it all per nom. Csworldwide1 (talk) 15:39, 5 January 2020 (UTC)

  Y Merger complete. Klbrain (talk) 21:08, 19 May 2020 (UTC)

Cleanup

I'm giving this article a bit of an overhaul. It's clearly one of those articles that gets added to by everyone about their local traditions and has a lot of repitition, uncited text, and even some promotion. Please discuss here if you are concerned that the size of the article is shrinking. --Cornellier (talk) 22:49, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

Thankyou Sleddog71, Timothy Titus, and Arjayay for fixing my typos! --Cornellier (talk) 01:07, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

Proposed merge of Roscón into King cake

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Very short article that can be merged into the article that will give fuller context Spudlace (talk) 21:04, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Does the roscón have much use outside of the roscón de Reyes? If not, a merge makes sense, but if there are more types of roscón, this would be a bit like merging cake into birthday cake. Ibadibam (talk) 22:51, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

Oppose as part Ibadibam, given that roscón de Reyes is only one use of roscón.Klbrain (talk) 22:09, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.