Talk:Homura Akemi

Missing informations

There are many missing informations regarding Homura's characterization in Rebellion that needs to be added. In Rebellion Production Notes, it's stated The Clara Dolls throw tomatoes at Homura whenever she lies, and they ridiculed her and disobey her because she hates herself and feels that she herself doesn't deserve happiness. Everything about a witch in some way reflects her feelings, the labyrinth, the shape, the familiars, etc. In the Official Guidebook Only You, it's written that the black dress (known as mourning dress) Homura wears is for her own funeral. The Nutcracker witch (Homura's witch form) also wants to "execute herself" for how useless she (Homura) is and for failing in protecting Madoka. It's also revealed that Homura turning to (purple) lizard is a symbolisms for how lizard's tail "grows again even if it is cut" - Homura also travels back in time to "start again from the beginning". There are still many notes on how Homura sees herself but I haven't translated all of them (my Japanese isn't very good). Homura doesn't have a good view of herself so I believe all of these informations needs to be added especially because they are notes from the creators since what the creators say are facts, not interpretations. The design section also needs work. There's literally nothing written about her Witch form and Devil form. The official guidebook Only You went into great details about how her Witch and Devil form were created/designed. Only You has many interesting interviews with the staff/voice casts on how they see Homura. Urobuchi also said that "Madoka is not just a victim" but Homura also is, and "Madoka's wishes have not been denied by Homura". I'm not really sure (didn't really understand it well) but it's kind of implied by Shinbo and Urobuchi that a next Madoka sequel would be about Salvation or Redemption...not really sure since I didn't understand that part well. I would also suggest reworking on the entire page. The "Psychoanalysis" subsection needs to be reworked on, it's mostly using one source (Jed A. Blue). Bryan J. McAfee has also written many interesting analysis about Homura in his book, such as Homura being suicidal and how Rebellion isn't even subtle in portraying her depression as having reached suicidal levels. And the repeated utterances of "Fort Da" an element from Freudian psychology dealing with a child who repeatedly destroyed themself by hiding from their reflection, denial of pleasure, and masochism, is a reference to Homura's feelings. The development section also needs a major rewrite especially the first and third paragraph. I'm writing this because I checked Kyoko and Sayaka's article which are very well-written while Homura seems to have many (unnecessary) informations written badly. Madoka's page is lacking while Mami doesn't even have a page. Anyways, I'll try translating the book and may post it here. Good luck! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.231.227.249 (talk) 23:43, 26 July 2020 (UTC)

Is the below paragraph helpful? If so, in which section does it belong to?

"Rebellion portrays the psychological battle in its own unique artistic style. Homulilly, Homura's witch form, shackled, her head broken, crowned with red spider lilies, being led off to the guillotine by an army of her familiars. In Japan, the red spider lily is associated with funerals and death. Her head is broken, not only a reference to the Nutcracker, whose jaw was broken rendering it useless for cracking nuts, but also a visual metaphor for her own feelings of worthlessness at having failed to save Madoka. From her back protrudes a phonograph speaker, symbolizing how her life has been a broken record, repeating the same tragic events over and over. She goes willingly to her execution, but part of her still clings to the desire to live. The ribbons on the back of her dress turn into giant arms, grabbing at building and tearing the city apart in a vain attempt to stop her determined march to death." ~Bryan J. McAfee — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.231.227.249 (talk) 00:10, 27 July 2020 (UTC)

Hmmm... Perhaps the GA reviewer could address it. -iaspostb□x+ 13:03, 29 August 2020 (UTC)

GAN

Should I nominate this article for GA status? NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 21:01, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

It seems like a good GA candidate so feel free to nominate it. The GA nomination will also give you feedback on areas that needs to be worked on, if there is any. DarkFallenAngel (talk) 22:57, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

Done! NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 23:30, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

This review is transcluded from Talk:Homura Akemi/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Lee Vilenski (talk · contribs) 12:22, 11 September 2020 (UTC)

Hello, I am planning on reviewing this article for GA Status, over the next couple of days. Thank you for nominating the article for GA status. I hope I will learn some new information, and that my feedback is helpful.

If nominators or editors could refrain from updating the particular section that I am updating until it is complete, I would appreciate it to remove a edit conflict. Please address concerns in the section that has been completed above (If I've raised concerns up to references, feel free to comment on things like the lede.)

I generally provide an overview of things I read through the article on a first glance. Then do a thorough sweep of the article after the feedback is addressed. After this, I will present the pass/failure. I may use strikethrough tags when concerns are met. Even if something is obvious why my concern is met, please leave a message as courtesy.

Best of luck! you can also use the {{done}} tag to state when something is addressed. Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)}

Please let me know after the review is done, if you were happy with the review! Obviously this is regarding the article's quality, however, I want to be happy and civil to all, so let me know if I have done a good job, regardless of the article's outcome.

Immediate Failures

• It is a long way from meeting any one of the six good article criteria -
• It contains copyright infringements -
• It has, or needs, cleanup banners that are unquestionably still valid. These include{{cleanup}}, {{POV}}, {{unreferenced}} or large numbers of {{citation needed}}, {{clarify}}, or similar tags. (See also {{QF-tags}}). -
• It is not stable due to edit warring on the page. -

Links

Prose

Lede

• Chiwa Saito is missing an accent Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:21, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  • You mean her Japanese romanization? – Like this "Chiwa Saitō"? NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
    • I do - or at least her article has the diacritic on the o as well. We should be consistent with names in this way. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:16, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
      •  Done NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 14:08, 26 September 2020 (UTC)
• Madoka from making contract with the messenger of magic - something is wrong here "Madoka from making a contract with the messenger of magic" or Madoka from making contact with the messenger of magic"? Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:21, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  • Fixed. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
• Do we need to link surreal? Seems like a common enough word. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:21, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  • Removed link. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
• I feel the first para on the conception and such is probably the more notable stuff than her canon. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:21, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  • What do you mean? Could you elaborate more? NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
• Chiwa Saito voices her in the Japanese version of the series, while Cristina Vee voices her in the English version. - repeat "voices her", but there should be a better way to say this. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:21, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  • Revised. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
• remains popular among fans - do we really care about this? Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:21, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  • Well, she still tops anime character polls in Japan so I thought it's worth mentioning. If you feel it's unnecessary then I will remove it! NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
    • Might be worth saying exactly that - rather than the more general overview. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:17, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
      • Removed as I feel it's unnecessary. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 14:08, 26 September 2020 (UTC)
• For voicing Homura, Saito won the 2011 Newtype Anime Award for Best Supporting Actress. - move to the section on voice acting. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:21, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  • Removed sentence. It's already in the "Critical response" section. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)

General

• Accent for Saito in the caption also needs an accent. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:27, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
• The article in general has some issues with linking quite common terms - heart disease, experiment, masterpiece et al. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:27, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  • Removed links. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
• In The Rebellion Story is uncited. If this were plot, it isn't so bad, but at least a citation for the translations. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:27, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  •  Done. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
• PlayStation Portable action video game WP:SEAOFBLUE/ Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:27, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  •  Done. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
• Critical response has a major issue with WP:CITEKILL. 3 is the maximum amount of citations in a row - either kill the ones not needed, or try WP:BUNDLING. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:27, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  •  Done. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
• "Analysis" seems pretty WP:CRUFTY in my eyes - specifically the quotes. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:27, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  • So what do you suggest? Should I rewrite the section or just trim? NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
    • Trim the quotes - I'm a bit of a stickler for only adding quotes that actually make (or agree to) points in the article. There's a lot of quite long quotes that could be trimmed a bit. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:19, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
      • I trimmed some of the quotes. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 14:08, 26 September 2020 (UTC)
• Merchandising could do with an image - but seems like mostly a list of things that they have merchandise of. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 15:27, 18 September 2020 (UTC)
  • Thanks for the review! I will go through it and address the points you have noted in the next few days. NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 17:49, 19 September 2020 (UTC)
    • No worries. It's a nice article. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 18:23, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

GA Review

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

1. It is reasonably well written.

   a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):

2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.

   a (reference section): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):

3. It is broad in its coverage.

   a (major aspects): b (focused):

4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.

   Fair representation without bias:

5. It is stable.

   No edit wars, etc.:

6. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.

   a (images are tagged and non-free content have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):

7. Overall:

   Pass/Fail:

Review meta comments

• I'll begin the review as soon as I can! If you fancy returning the favour, I have a list of nominations for review at WP:GAN and WP:FAC, respectively. I'd be very grateful if you were to complete one of these if you get time. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 12:22, 11 September 2020 (UTC)
  • Any updates on this NotEnglishSpeaker? Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 16:39, 24 September 2020 (UTC)
    • I'm very sorry for getting late to it, I've been really busy lately...Anyways, great review! Looking forward to your responses! NotEnglishSpeaker (talk) 13:06, 25 September 2020 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Circlejerk and advertising

Reading this as a third-party not related to wikipedia editors, this article reeks of journalists who only put their own stories in even though they are not relevent to the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.231.161.68 (talk) 09:48, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

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Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 23:14, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Untitled section

I have to say this article isn't really well-written because there are many points of the character to be addressed. It has a bit of good information and is quite readable. But I'm afraid to say that it lacks very very important contents as it does not properly address how the creators developed and designed Homura and the plan for using her character in the series. There also needs to be more explanation of Homura's "characterization and themes", such as Homura developing trauma in having to watch her friends die over and over again or mercy kill Madoka or having to be hospitalized for a year(?), or being severely depressed and suicidal in Rebellion, or proclaiming herself as the devil and takes the villain's role because that's how she sees herself (she has low self esteem), or her Clara Dolls ridiculing her and throw tomatoes at her whenever she lies, or the meaning behind Homulilly's symbolisms, etc. There should be much more information to Homura's characterization because it is crucial and important to the main story and leads to a better understanding of her character. The article also needs to cite more from the production and staff of the series, especially the writer and director of the series because they give a more accurate description of Homura and her role in the series.

The "development" of the character is interesting but needs to be expanded and described more in details, because so far, it reads like trivia. The description of Homura's design is also not clear and should be more detailed. There needs to be more images as well. As for analysis, why are the sources written by one author? Who is Jed A. Blue? Are their interpretation of the character really that important? I believe Japanese critics must be mentioned more; multiple JP critics and writers have commented on Homura's character. Also, is it me or "critical response" section is too extensively detailed? And there is no mention of Japanese critics, like really? How come? Some of the sentences are also awkward and wordy.

Overall, this article is decently written. It focuses less on the development and design and psychological of the character and her reception in Japan. There needs to be more explanations of her character, what her promise with Madoka means, how she tried to save other girls and warn them but nobody listens to her, her relationship with Madoka and the other girls, her self-loathing/low self esteem issues, her trauma and struggle against fate, her monologue/feelings when she turns into a witch, the meaning of her mourning dress and her witch form Homulilly, why she dethroned Madoka (Law of Cycles) from heaven, and etc. Again, this article is not interesting, it lacks many components of the character, and the description of the character's perspective in the series. There needs to be different approaches to describing different components of Homura's character. And please, stop using Jed A. Blue as the only source for analysis. Add Japanese critics if you can. This article is overly detailed yet it feels nothing really informative. I think this article reads more like trivias. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.128.82.141 (talk) 14:53, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

The article looks fine to me. DarkFallenAngel (talk) 16:20, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

It looks mediocre. This article doesn't talk about Homura's development and character in details. The "Critical response" is overly detailed, I suggest trimming some contents. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.128.82.141 (talk) 17:28, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• Cristina Vee.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 04:40, 20 September 2021 (UTC)

Wording in the article

I understand that the show is dark mahou shoujo, but please don't overuse the term "magical girl" even where the term is not required. Homura is literally a divine entity like Akuma Homura (literally, Devil Homura) and the term mg is redundant here. I also wanted to point out that the word "vision" is really more appropriate here, since the word dream in the context of "one of her nightmares" would be an obvious tautology, since a nightmare is a bad dream. Hope for understanding. Solaire the knight (talk) 13:21, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

I'm sorry, but my information is completely correct, and you can check out the movie Rebellion to make sure about it. This is not an edit war at all, it's just an information about the character in the movie. Homura Akemi is a devil in the film but she's not a divine entity. For the nightmare, it was just a dream and that's clearly a better wording for the article. Thanks. Phil81194 (talk) 13:32, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

I'm afraid you can't wage an edit war by reverting your version just because you think you're right. Whether you think you're right or you really are, it's still a war of edits. In addition, I do not quite understand what the events of the film have to do with this, since we are talking about wording that is not directly related to the plot. Unless there were verbatim quotes in the movie about how Madoka saw Homura in a "dream in one of her nightmares" or that Homura's demonic form was a magical girl. The demonic form is clearly different from the form of the magical girl, otherwise the plot did not emphasize it. Also, it would be literary correct to say that she saw Homura "in one of her nightmares", not that Homura was one of the dreams in her nightmares, which sounds pretty bad. Solaire the knight (talk) 13:46, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

The first episode of the anime series is titled, "As If I Met Her in My Dream..." and that's the correct information about the character that should be written in the article, and for the film I suggest you to understand the story before changing any information. Phil81194 (talk) 14:02, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

The fact that she met her in one of her dreams is really correct. But the phrase "saw her as a dream in one of nightmares" has bad wording, since a nightmare is a form of dream. It would be more correct to say "I saw her in one of her nightmares." Or at least "saw her in one of dreams." Also, she couldn't see the character AS A DREAM, she could see the character IN A DREAM. Even the text you quoted contains such a form. Solaire the knight (talk) 14:05, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Phil81194, how about changing the first phrase to "first appeared in one of Madoka's nightmares" and the second to "devil form" but without "divine" or "magical"? It seems to me that this will be the most optimal and compromise solution (especially considering the result of the administrator), besides, since we are both warned for an edit war, we can calmly agree and ask uninvolved people to sum up. Solaire the knight (talk) 14:53, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Yes, that's it, I agree. You can change the first phrase to "first appeared in one of Madoka's nightmares". And for the second one, you can use the "devil form". I agree. This is the end of the discussion. I just want to tell you something, can you please delete my discussion on your talk page and on this one, beacuse you started this and I don't like to leave stuff behind me on wikipedia, especially that the discussion is completely over. Thank you. Phil81194 (talk) 15:08, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Then what about archiving? In such cases, it is supposed to leave a comment "according to the consensus in the discussion", but I'm afraid that if the administrator does not see the dialogue, he will think that I just continued the edit war. Or alternatively, you can delete both discussions yourself later, for example, after a few days. Solaire the knight (talk) 15:14, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Ok, no problem. Phil81194 (talk) 15:19, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

UPD. BlankpopsiclesilviaASHs4 did it for me, so if you don't mind, I'll archive this thread as definitively out of date due to dispute resolution. As for the thread on my page, I have already deleted it, since its existence did not require any action. Solaire the knight (talk) 15:20, 27 July 2023 (UTC)