I just ordered just about every print biography of Lovecraft that exists. In the coming months I'd like to bring this article up to much better than the C-class it currently is. Help is welcome. Particularly with copy editing. Capeo (talk) 05:49, 8 November 2017 (UTC)
- So I've spent a lot of time on the early life section in my sandbox . As is quite clear right now the only source is Joshi's I am Providence, a thousand plus pages I'm making my way through. Obviously my intent is not for that to be the only source. De Camp and Tyson just got delivered and I am I'm going to start going through those as well. I'd like to see this article follow a structure more akin to typical GA and FA articles: a solid biography section with chronologically ordered subheaders, then themes inherent in the writer's work, and an influence section that is much smaller than all the fancruft stuck in here now. The article also badly needs a unifying of its citation style.
- What I don't want to do is spend a bunch of time expanding the biography and then drop what amounts to a totally new article in there just to be reverted. So I'd love some collaboration. In my sandbox is two sections so far. The top is just an info dump with citations. The lower one is my first attempt to pare it down. It can be pared down more. My biggest difficulty right now, aside from some just some good copy editing, is balancing straightforward biographical information with how influential biographers find this information on Lovecraft's work. Joshi, fairly early, deals a good deal with Lovecraft's apparent disdain for physical affection. It's only in Lovecraft's later high school years that he spends a long time on his racism, hearkening back to early influences, that would require going back and bringing them up in Early Years section.
- Long story short, feel free to comment here, or in my sandbox, and edit the lower section. 03:16, 14 November 2017 (UTC)Capeo (talk)
It needs trimming, and copy editing (and thanks to the editors that have already fixed my bad grammar), but I'm still of the mind that an article that's a biography should mainly be... a biography, in keeping with other GA and FA bios. That said, I expect substantial trimming will need to happen. For instance, even the section I just added. The UAPA was an incredibly important part of Lovecraft's life. More exhaustive bios go into great detail about it (Joshi, de Camp). Less exhaustive one's simply mention it. Somewhere in between is best for a WP bio. Right now I'm on the exhaustive end of the spectrum. It's hard to source, and I'm reticent to source, large sweeping proclamations about Lovecraft based on single sentences. A good for instance would be that a lot of the internet sources perpetuate a non-factual myth that Lovecraft experienced night terrors, sleep paralysis, etc., despite there being no evidence suggesting that to be case. That's one of the main reasons I'm leaning towards written sources as being the predominant sources at this stage. Beyond all that, I'm mostly looking for any collaboration and, at the same time, some approval I guess. Meaning, I fully expect significant trimming, I expected this article to be watched more than it apparently is. I just don't want, weeks of work now and more to come, suddenly reverted because nobody put forth their objections earlier. Capeo (talk) 02:32, 20 November 2017 (UTC)
- An IP removed the section on class and race with an explanation that it didn't discuss his stories. I reverted the edit because it appeared to have reliable sources which did discuss his writings. I'm not bonded to the issue either way and will let consensus decide. Ifnord (talk) 04:26, 3 January 2018 (UTC)
- Well I think it large scale reversion including full revert back to before you started is likely, because you are expanding with long argumentative chains of reasoning rather than adding referenced encyclopedic content. Previously concise sections are being puffed up like a bullfrog with argumentation and nebulous speculation.. For instance
- In April 1893, after a psychotic episode in a Chicago hotel, Winfield was committed to Butler Hospital in Providence.Though it is not clear who reported Winfield's prior behavior to Butler, medical records indicate that he had been "doing and saying strange things at times" for a year before his commitment. Winfield spent five years in Butler before dying in 1898. His death certificate listed the cause of death as general paresis, a term synonymous with late-stage syphilis. Susie never exhibited symptoms of the disease, leading to questions regarding the intimacy of their relationship. In 1969 Sonia Greene ventured that Susie was a "touch-me-not" wife and that Winfield, being a traveling salesmen, "took his sexual pleasures wherever he could find them". How Greene came to this opinion is unknown, as she never met Lovecraft's parents, though Lovecraft himself termed his mother a "touch-me-not" in a 1937 letter noting that, after his early childhood, she avoided all physical contact with him. This is contrary to Susie's treatment of a young Lovecraft soon after his father's breakdown. According to the accounts of family friends Susie doted over the young Lovecraft to a fault, pampering him and never letting him out of her sight. Throughout his life Lovecraft maintained that his father fell into a paralytic state, due to insomnia and being overworked, and remained that way until his death. It is unknown if Lovecraft was simply kept ignorant of his father's illness or if his later remarks were intentionally misleading.
- Compare how it was before you started
- In 1893 Lovecraft's father became acutely psychotic, when Lovecraft was three, and was placed in the Providence psychiatric institution of Butler Hospital where he remained until his death in 1898. Lovecraft maintained throughout his life that his father died in a condition of paralysis brought on by "nervous exhaustion." His father was diagnosed with general paresis suggesting that his mental illness was caused by late-stage syphilis, but neither Lovecraft nor his mother (who also died in Butler Hospital) seem to have shown signs of being infected with the disease.
- I think the way it was a few months ago is more encyclopedic, and you might have been placed to avoid wholesale reverts had you got one section into shape then posted it here for comments, rather then editing the article and implying that anyone who objects should speak up while you are in the middle of a flurry of main page editing that includes an altered structure for the article.Overagainst (talk) 20:44, 23 January 2018 (UTC)
- I wonder if it might be worth separating the discussions of his stories and themes into his bibliography article? That might help focus and slim it down, and give people an easier way to find commentary on his stories.Rjmail (talk) 21:29, 23 January 2018 (UTC)