Talk:Darkseid

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Image edit warringEdit

OK, Reggie Herman, Teridax122, you guys really need to cool your jets. You are both in violation of the three revert rule and are clearly engaged in an edit war. You're lucky neither of you have been blocked. I can't even really tell what you are arguing about, but I have to concur that Reggie Herman's image should be the preferred one as Teridax122's is much larger than a standard infobox size. As to the provenance of the image, if you look at the issue in question on GCD, the penciller and colorist are who Reggie Herman says they are, and I will assume good faith that RH is telling the truth. You both ought to familiarize yourself with the WP:3RR and WP:EW guidelines so that you can avoid being blocked in the future. When you have a content dispute, take it to the talk page first. That said, if this keeps going on after my post, I will report one or both of you for edit warring. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 17:13, 3 November 2019 (UTC)

The edit-warring by both editors is entirely unacceptable and would almost definitely result in a block for both should it be reported at WP:AN3. I have left warnings on the talk pages of both editors. Both need to stop reverting each other, discuss the matter here and gain consensus. For now, I have reverted to the original image per WP:STATUSQUO while discussion is underway, during which time nobody should change the image. Any such editing will result in an immediate WP:AN3 report. ---AussieLegend () 19:50, 3 November 2019 (UTC)
I'm sorry for my behavior in going back and forth, in the future I'll try and do better and follow the 3RR rule to avoid any other edit war. Now I'll ask if the size of image is really a deep issue, because it's size can easily be altered with a new version. Also, that link you shared is my image not RH's. --Teridax122 (talk) 22:13, 3 November 2019 (UTC)
I don't follow. Based on what I saw in the reverts, your image was the one from Final Crisis, and Reggie Herman's was from the Justice League comic. Am I understanding this incorrectly? For context, I am referring to the image in the infobox that keeps getting changed. After looking through the reverts I'm still not sure what your dispute is over besides not agreeing on which image should be in the infobox, per this diff. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 22:25, 3 November 2019 (UTC)
I can't find any source that does confirms the author's of RH's image, not even as a variant cover. The link you offered that was supposed to conform RH's image is instead of another image that I uploaded for the "New 52" section of the page.--Teridax122 (talk) 22:34, 3 November 2019 (UTC)
I was referring to the art for the issue as a whole, not necessarily the cover. However, after looking in the issue myself, I also could not find this particular image. That does not excuse the edit warring but I now see where you are coming from. I would still, however, recommend a better infobox image. There are a couple in the Justice League 23.1 that I think would work, as I still think that the current image is of poor quality. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 23:21, 3 November 2019 (UTC)
My apologies, I was simply going forward on getting my image that is much clearer with high-res. Reggie Herman (talk) 00:04, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
@Etzedek24 Could you define "poor quality" for me, the image is clear, the character is obvious and center, and is also a mix of classic Darkseid and his more modern design (like the Omega symbol).--Teridax122 (talk) 00:34, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

Please see the stipulations for Wikiproject Comics manual of style when it comes to infobox images, particularly:

  • The ideal image is a full-body, three-quarter picture of the character standing straight with no background, with a facing-the-camera or profile picture as the next-best.
  • Colouring should be neutral - pictures which have a heavy colour cast, or otherwise depict the character with false colours should not be uploaded unless the cast has been removed first.
  • Heavily stylised art should only be considered for use when the character is closely associated with the style to the exclusion of less extreme styles.

With this in mind, I would argue that the image of Darkseid from Zero Hour that is on the page would be suitable. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 01:05, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

How is the current image not meeting the qualifiers you've shown? Is it the inclusion of a downed Superman? The only thing not in it's favor that I can see based on the qualifiers is that his foot is covered.--Teridax122 (talk) 01:31, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
The image has a background, is strongly-colored, and is not a standard costume. The Zero Hour picture is much better. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 01:37, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
In that case might I propose this image 1 be used instead of the Zero Hour image, and both the Zero Hour and the Final Crisis Variant be deleted?--Teridax122 (talk) 02:02, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
There's no provenance for that image and it's also cutting out part of the character. I haven't seen you advance a reason why the Zero Hour picture shouldn't be used (also, we may want to see if it's actually from Zero Hour as its caption and file name say it's from Crisis on Infinite Earths). Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 06:16, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
It's from Jack Kirby's Fourth Wold #20 by John Byrne with the cover by Walter Simonson. Only a lit bit of Darkseid's toe is missing which I can easily fix by finding the original cover. I feel that is is better than the Zero Hour image because it show off who the villain Darkseid is in a more dynamic way being from a issue cover, while the Zero Hour image is just cut from a panel of an issue. Art from a cover would be more preferable for an infobox image, as it is the first image the readers will see, and offers good artwork of the character. The Zero Hour image has not been given enough attention as to identify who the artist actually is while I can easily show that Walter Simonson is the artist of the new image I found 1. --Teridax122 (talk) 14:49, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

I would support this proposal. I have verified through GCD that Walt Simonson did draw this cover and I have digitally altered it to remove the background. Other editors are welcome to comment on this proposal. If no objections are heard within the next few days I will update the image accordingly. Though I should also add that I went through both Zero Hour #1 and COIE #8 and could not find the above-mentioned "Zero Hour" image. I will check the rest of Zero Hour, but it was not in any COIE issue. If it is not in Zero Hour, it should be deleted. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 17:21, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

I have also prepared an image of Simonson's Darkseid, if you would like to see it 1. If your image is already to go then never mind, it's just I had already prepared this as the discussion progressed, but nothing for me to worry about.--Teridax122 (talk) 17:37, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
I have gone through Zero Hour and confirmed that the image in question above does, in fact, appear in the series, but the caption was wrong. Thus, I have updated it. However, now that I know this image is now valid, I restate my support for it for the infobox. It meets all the guidelines set in the Wikiproject Comics style manual and is already in the article. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 17:21, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
If I could get my two cents in this, how about this picture from DC Rebirth Wonder Woman #37. A lot of the pictures you guys have been suggesting are kinda old and doesn’t it seem better to get a picture that is modern and new. Love to get your thoughts Etzedek24 on the image. Reggie Herman (talk) 18:08, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
Please do read the style guidelines I've linked above. There's no requirement that an image be newer. The style guidelines favor neutral poses without intense coloring, not action shots. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 18:20, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
By that argument the image in the infobox is too an action shot similarity standing over another body. With a little cropping, I think the image could be fine as it does meet the requirement. Reggie Herman (talk) 18:27, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
Yes, you're right, which is why I'm in favor of removing it. However, the proposed image from Wonder Woman has the same issues. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 18:35, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
Same issues? Like what’s the artists names or is it still from the guideline where I missed something? Reggie Herman (talk) 18:38, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

From the MOS, "The ideal image is a full-body, three-quarter picture of the character standing straight with no background, with a facing-the-camera or profile picture as the next-best." Your proposed image simply has too much going on with the background, and the rays of energy emanating from the eyes and hand. For our purposes, we need a more neutral image such as the Zero Hour one in the page already or the alternative Teridax122 has proposed. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 18:43, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

Just so it's made clear, thought the Zero Hour image has been properly identified as by Dan Jurgens and Jerry Ordway, its file name is still Darkseidgeogreperez, George Perez we now know has no involvement with this artwork.--Teridax122 (talk) 20:04, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
That's somewhat inconsequential. The caption has been fixed, the filename is not of as much importance and cannot be easily changed. Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 20:19, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
Is it too late to suggest this image as well? Still from Wonder Woman #37 but with a little cropping this might turnout better. Reggie Herman (talk) 21:21, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

RfC on appropriate infobox imageEdit

The following discussion is an archived record of a request for comment. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.
Uninvolved editors reached consensus that the best infobox image for the page per WP:CMOS#BOXIMAGE is the Zero Hour profile already in the article.

Keeping in mind the Wikiproject Comics manual of style, which infobox image would best suit the article? Etzedek24 (I'll talk at ya) (Check my track record) 18:47, 4 November 2019 (UTC)

  1. Option 1 Zero Hour image
  2. Option 2 this comic book cover
  3. Option 3 Wonder Woman #37

Question rephrased for clarity by Argento Surfer. Original version can be seen here

Just so you know, option 2 will look like this 1 with the background removed.--Teridax122 (talk) 22:46, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
  • Option 1 followed by Option 2 then Option 3 Cynistrategus (talk) 05:30, 11 November 2019 (UTC)
  • Procedural comment: This has been open for a week now, and the editors involved in the dispute have not participated. Based on the responses to this RfC, I will update the infobox image to be Option 1, the altered Zero Hour appearance, which best satisfies the guidelines at WP:CMOS#BOXIMAGE.

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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