Talk:Celebrity Big Brother 1 (American season)/Archive 1

Archive 1

1?

If we're not sure there is going to be a second season, should we move this article to Celebrity Big Brother (U.S.)? ---Another Believer _(Talk) 05:00, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

I'd say no because in the case that enough seasons air we may create a page specifically about the U.S. adaption similar to Big Brother (U.S.) in which case we'd just have to move it back.TheDoctorWho (talk) 05:03, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

Sure, but moving pages is easy. And unless sourcing suggests "Celebrity Big Brother 1" is the name of the series, we should probably move the page, especially if this may be a one-time thing. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 05:06, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

Julie Chen stated in The Hollywood Reporter (reference number 6) "that if it has a big following and makes enough money that we're no fools" meaning that it's possible it may not be a one time thing.TheDoctorWho (talk) 14:26, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

Right if the show hits the ratings target and makes the money CBS wants it will most likely be back. However as far as Wikipedia goes we shouldn't title this as Celebrity Big Brother 1 (U.S.) at this stage until CBS announces it themselves it is coming back for a second season which at the earliest will happen during the show's run on air. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 18:20, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

I say yes because we don't know if there will be a second season of Celebrity Big Brother (U.S.). Leaving the article title as it is would be a case of WP:CRYSTALBALL.--OfficerAPC (talk) 18:20, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

I personally don't have any problem with the article being titled Celebrity Big Brother 1 (U.S.) but the naming needs to follow Wikipedia guidelines which is why I recommend it being moved to Celebrity Big Brother (U.S.). Having it titled Celebrity Big Brother 1 (U.S.) falls into WP:CRYSTAL and implies that a second season will happen. Because this season will be occurring during the 2017–18 ratings season (typically September - May) the fate of the show most likely will be included in CBS' upfront presentations for the 2018–19 network season which will happen in May 2018. At this stage the Celebrity variant of the show wouldn't warrant enough information for its own article and the article for the British adaptation wasn't created until 2006 and at that point it had 4 seasons under its belt and there were enough differences between the celebrity version and the civilian version to warrant a separate article. So my recommendation is to move it to Celebrity Big Brother (U.S.) until CBS announces a second season. Then once there is a second season this article can move back to Celebrity Big Brother 1 (U.S.). That way if the need ever arises to split the celebrity information from the main article it can be done at that time. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 18:14, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for moving the article. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 19:35, 8 September 2017 (UTC)

Shouldn't this be Celebrity Big Brother (U.S. TV series) per WP:NCTV and like Big Brother (U.S. TV series)? Also the UK article should also be moved to Celebrity Big Brother (UK TV series). - Brojam (talk) 04:28, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

I'm about to make a move request on the UK one. But I think this one is okay per Wikipedia:WikiProject Big Brother TheDoctorWho (talk) 12:38, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

Now that CBS has officially confirmed a second season of Celebrity Big Brother, we can put the 1 back in the title for this article. OfficerAPC (talk) 03:20, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

Because it has been OFFICIALLY renewed this is now OFFICIALLY the first season and I believe it should be moved because it primarily is about the [now known] first season. Once enough information is created then a second season article and/or an article specifically about the series. If moved an article could probably be created now specifically be created about the series however I believe it would a stub. TheDoctorWho (talk) 05:35, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

A split could also be considered splitting out any information having to do with only the first season. Also a decision to move would require that List of Celebrity Big Brother houseguests (U.S.) also be moved. TheDoctorWho (talk) 05:55, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

Once the article for Celebrity Big Brother 2 (U.S.) can be created closer to when the season starts then this one can be moved to Celebrity Big Brother 1 (U.S.) and this title Celebrity Big Brother (U.S. TV series) can be redirected to the main Big Brother (U.S. TV series) article until it can be expanded to a standalone article like Celebrity Big Brother (UK TV series) has. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 07:27, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

I'm fine with waiting until closer to the second season to create the article and redirecting the CBB article to the BB article but I still believe this one should be moved to a season 1 page sooner than later. TheDoctorWho (talk) 12:47, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

At the moment Celebrity Big Brother 2 (U.S.) is redirected to this article, which should be renamed according to WP:NCTV standards, which would be Celebrity Big Brother (U.S. season 1) and the upcoming article for next year would be named Celebrity Big Brother (U.S. season 2). OfficerAPC (talk) 16:00, 13 May 2018 (UTC)

I agree with Alucard 16 about moving the pages MSalmon (talk) 22:27, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

Let's make this easier on all of us and I'm just gonna file a RM. TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:23, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

Please join the discussion below at Requested move 15 May 2018. TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:38, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

New Edits

Since the first 6 HouseGuests were released, I decided to make the HouseGuest list, add their names in the legend, and create a basic table for the voting history. We can adjust as more information is released for new houseguests, starting dates, etc. NintendoGeek (talk) 09:24, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

That's great except your source led to BB19 house guests, we don't know how many weeks there are going to be, there's no other sources, and someone else already reverted your edits. TheDoctorWho (talk) 12:40, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

That's because I copied the one from BB19 over to here so I didn't mess anything up. I tried to change everything possible. It's quite unfortunate someone decided to remove all of my work and then give me a 'warning' about false information when I clearly had a link posted to it. It's whatever though.. NintendoGeek (talk) 16:36, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

The website that listed those houseguests is of questionable validity... should wait till an official source releases the cast list. Spanneraol (talk) 18:16, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

Correct, official cast information is best cited through CBS sources first so let's wait until then. --JC (talk) 20:15, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

Understood, I apologize for the error and will keep that noted. NintendoGeek (talk) 22:28, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

Celebrity Big Brother

I opened a move request on Talk:Celebrity Big Brother if anyone wants to join in.

Requested move 11 September 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Moved. Consensus that per NCTV we should include "TV series"  — Amakuru (talk) 13:42, 18 September 2017 (UTC)

---

Celebrity Big Brother (U.S.) → Celebrity Big Brother (U.S. TV series) – Someone recently suggested a page move on this page due to WP:NCTV I personally OPPOSE this because of Wikipedia:WikiProject Big Brother however I found it better to resolve this here on the articles talk page. TheDoctorWho (talk) 01:57, 11 September 2017 (UTC)

• Oppose per nom. TheDoctorWho (talk) 03:23, 12 September 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose Should match other existing series which dont include the tv series tag. Spanneraol (talk) 02:18, 11 September 2017 (UTC) Change to support.. the arguments below convinced me. Spanneraol (talk) 12:44, 13 September 2017 (UTC)

I agree with that. I'm just trying to allow everyone their opinion.TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:22, 11 September 2017 (UTC)

• Support per WP:NCTV. NCTV is the naming convention for all TV programs within the TV Wikiproject, of which WikiProject Big Brother is a child. If WikiProject Big Brother wants exceptions for related projects, it should be discussed at NCTV. Until then, the project wide naming convention should be followed. The desires of a child Wikiproject should not override the consensus of the parent project. --AussieLegend (✉) 09:35, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose: Agree with Spanneraol. { [ ( jjj 1238 ) ] } 09:57, 11 September 2017 (UTC)

Not really a cogent argument. What justification is there to ignore the naming convention that applies to ALL TV programs? --AussieLegend (✉) 12:07, 11 September 2017 (UTC)

• Support as per WP:NCTV, what AussieLegend has said, and the current discussion at WT:NCTV. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 12:45, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
• Support per AussieLegend, IJBall and WP:NCTV. Also, opposing because of WP:BIGBROTHER is not valid since the main series' use this format: Big Brother (U.S. TV series), Big Brother (UK TV series), Big Brother (Australian TV series), Big Brother (Indonesian TV series), etc. - Brojam (talk) 17:47, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
• Support per others above. WP:NCTV is pretty clear on this, and that should take precedence over WP:BIGBROTHER, as it applies to the simplest aspect of this, that is a television series. Also, subsequently, if this change needs to be applied to other Big Brother-related articles, I support that too. - Favre1fan93 (talk) 18:10, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
• Support - no option unless you want to change WP:NCTV. -- Netoholic @ 20:43, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose For the U.S. version of Big Brother, individual seasons did not have TV series in the title. Renaming the article to Celebrity Big Brother (U.S. TV series) would also be a case of WP:CRYSTAL as it suggests multiple seasons to come, with only one confirmed so far to air.--OfficerAPC (talk) 21:30, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Please review the discussion at WT:NCTV – the individual season articles for BB are properly named and don't need to be moved, but the "Celebrity" version is not, and should be moved to Celebrity Big Brother (U.S. TV series) as per WP:NCTV. This has nothing to do with WP:CRYSTALBALL. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 23:31, 11 September 2017 (UTC)
  • Not a WP:CRYSTALBALL situation at all - a series is a series even if it only lasts one season. -- Netoholic @ 02:32, 12 September 2017 (UTC)
    • I have to agree with IJBall and Netoholic. Individual seasons don't usually have "TV series" in the title so that's not really relevant. WP:CRYSTAL certainly doesn't apply. The number of seasons has nothing to do with naming of articles. Importantly, the lead of this article starts with "Celebrity Big Brother is a spin-off series", so I don't see the issue with including "series" in the title per NCTV. --AussieLegend (✉) 05:30, 12 September 2017 (UTC)
      • @AussieLegend: Technically CBS has never said it was a series in its own right they just said "special winter edition" in the press release with the summer season in 2018 still called the twentieth season. I've tried to change the lead but I was reverted so I have given up. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 03:09, 13 September 2017 (UTC)
        • @Alucard 16: - The press release has two lines of interest - 1) "BIG BROTHER has been dominating pop culture throughout its 19 seasons" 2) "BIG BROTHER's milestone 20th season that will be broadcast in summer 2018". This indicates that CBB (which airs in winter) is not season 20, and doesn't fit in the season numbering progression, and so will be a separate series. -- Netoholic @ 04:20, 13 September 2017 (UTC)
          • @Netoholic: Just because the winter season isn't season 20 doesn't mean this season has been entirely spun off into a series. There have been shows before that have spun off one season from the rest. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 12:16, 13 September 2017 (UTC)
            • I can't even parse what you mean here – if it airs between "season 19" and "season 20", is not itself "season 20", and has a different title (with a different format), how is it in any way not an entirely TV program/series?!... (To be clear "spinoff series" are still entirely different TV series than the TV programs they are spun off from...) Again, common sense should reign here, especially as WP:BIGBROTHER cannot come up with naming conventions that are contrary to its parent project, WP:TV/WP:NCTV... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 20:14, 13 September 2017 (UTC)
• Support As per WP:NCTV, the guideline is clear. ʍaɦʋɛօtʍ (talk) 11:47, 15 September 2017 (UTC)
• Support per WP:NCTV -- Whats new?^(talk) 23:46, 17 September 2017 (UTC)

---

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Logo

The article's prose currently says the show's logo features the word "celebrity", but this is not seen in the infobox image. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 19:27, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

@ChristmasCrackers: Pinging you, since you've added content about the logo. Thanks! ---Another Believer _(Talk) 19:27, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

@Another Believer: Logo updated ChristmasCrackers (talk) 19:30, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

@ChristmasCrackers and Another Believer: The infobox image was the logo used when they announced the show back in September as it was the closest image we had at the time. That's why it didn't have the word "celebrity" in it. All is good now. Thanks for uploading the new image. TheDoctorWho (talk) 19:35, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

@ChristmasCrackers and Another Believer: There is actually even a different logo at [1] which also includes the first teaser, do you think the logo there would be better suited? TheDoctorWho (talk) 19:47, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

This seems more like promotional artwork, but not the official logo. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 19:49, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

@Another Believer: Well at a time like this we would normally upload the a promotinal image then upload the official logo later when we get it. Same happened with BB19 we uploaded the pink logo until we were for sure that it was the blue logo again. I feel like the logo that is in there now is bad because it's cropped. I think it would be better to put in the logo from Big Brother Network plus it would look better because we could use the full image.

I don't feel strongly about which infobox image is used, I just noticed the discrepancy between the image and the article's prose. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 19:55, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

@Another Believer: Alright I'll wait and see if @ChristmasCrackers: has an opinion on which image is used. TheDoctorWho (talk) 20:01, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

I think this logo should be fine. This can be changedChristmasCrackers (talk) 11:30, 28 December 2017 (UTC)

When the series starts we’ll see which logo is used ChristmasCrackers (talk) 11:33, 28 December 2017 (UTC)

Has now been updated ChristmasCrackers (talk) 04:56, 3 January 2018 (UTC)

When the series starts the image can be changed ChristmasCrackers (talk) 23:38, 4 January 2018 (UTC)

HouseGuests section

Why is there a start of an edit war forming with the HouseGuests section where it keeps getting switched from a table [2] to breaking the HouseGuests out with individual headers [3]? There is no real reason to have the HouseGuests broken out of the table as it makes the article bigger than it needs to be and if anyone wants to know any specifics about a celebrity's career they can click on their name. This is something I've been meaning to bring up about all the Celebrity Big Brother (UK TV series) articles for a while but kept forgetting to but there is no reason for these sections. No other "celebrity" based reality show does this and the Celebrity Big Brother articles should follow the wider precedent used. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 03:11, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

I think we should treat this like a normal United States season and leave the houseguests in the table and create a houseguest article at List of Celebrity Big Brother houseguests (U.S.) and if we get a second season we can move that to List of Celebrity Big Brother 1 houseguests (U.S.) TheDoctorWho (talk) 03:15, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

There is no point for sections like that only the most important info like their name, age and what they are most known for should be listed. Anything relating to the current season of Big Brother will already be covered in this article. If the reader wants to know what other projects a celebrity was involved with they can visit their respective page. The only time another show should be worth noting is if the contestant was on another season of Big Brother somewhere in the world. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 03:24, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

I have started a discussion on the talk page for Celebrity Big Brother 21 (UK) MSalmon (talk) 20:56, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

Big Brother: After Dark

Big Brother: After Dark as been confirmed to return under the title Celebrity Big Brother: After Dark. The celebrity version has received it's own logo and its own promo video so the question is are they one show or is Celebrity Big Brother: After Dark a spin-off of Celebrity Big Brother following the format of Big Brother: After Dark or are they the same show??? Most spin-off shows usually don't change their logos and promos. TheDoctorWho (talk) 01:59, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

Pop the network that airs the series even added in one video description It's not too cold to stargaze—Celebrity Big Brother After Dark is here to heat things up which used the Celebrity Big Brother After Dark title and makes it sound like it's own series. TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:05, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

I don't think its going to be significantly different to warrant its own article though.. Its just gonna be the same after dark show...These things dont really have content. Spanneraol (talk) 03:31, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

@Spanneraol: Well I mean take a look at User:TheDoctorWho/sandbox4 I think I've found enough independent reliable sources to at least create an article. I mean even if it's a stub it would still be an article. TheDoctorWho (talk) 03:40, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

Does it need its own article? Can't it just be part of either the CBB article or the AD article? All it does is show live feeds with commercial breaks. Spanneraol (talk) 03:57, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

I wouldn't suggest adding it to the CBB article. My vote would be to allow it's own article or even though I'm against it if we were to add it to an article I'd say the BBAD page. TheDoctorWho (talk) 04:06, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

There really isn't a need for a completely separate article for Celebrity Big Brother After Dark. This is similar to Big Brother (UK) and Celebrity Big Brother (UK) where all the spin-off shows airing at the time typically return with "celebrity" added to the title. Having a section on the Big Brother: After Dark noting that during a "Celebrity" season the show is retaliated "Celebrity Big Brother After Dark" would be sufficient since both shows are the same just the title is adjusted to match its parent season. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 05:37, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

Alright I'll just add a bit to what I already added on the BBAD page when I find time. TheDoctorWho (talk) 12:43, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

Possible Mistake with Schedule?

I may be wrong here, but is this series scheduled to run for 26 days and not 19, assuming the fact that the celebrities moved in the house today from sequester? Letramsihtam (talk) 22:52, 31 January 2018

According to James' twitter from today they will move in tomorrow (February 1) MSalmon (talk) 23:00, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

The series runs 19 but they will be in the house for 26. There is a week between when the move in and when the show starts so they can get footage for the premiere. Spanneraol (talk) 23:02, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

Are they not moving in tomorrow? MSalmon (talk) 23:07, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure I heard they were moving in today but i cant find verifiable proof anywhere just now. The post on James twitter was from last night so that would imply today. Spanneraol (talk) 23:10, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

Does anyone know exactly when evictions are taking place? Letramsihtam (talk) 20:58, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Friday and Monday shows. Unknown if they will be live yet though.Spanneraol (talk) 21:01, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

I believe the Friday show was announced to be live if I'm not mistaken. TheDoctorWho (talk) 21:02, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Head of Household

So from now until the live feeds begin later tonight do we technically know who the current HoH is or should we leave it as Shannon. Because the HouseGuests have most likely already opened their bags. TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:05, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Yes.. Keisha becomes HOH later.. that was on the feeds this afternoon (they had a sneak peak for 15 minutes at 2 PM). Chuck and James were nominated. Spanneraol (talk) 02:09, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Alright sounds good. I usually watch the live feeds I just haven't been able to keep up with these sneak peaks sorry. TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:20, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Summary section

Hi everyone! I was looking at the past seasons of Big Brother and noticed the American seasons use a variety of formats for the Summary (or Episodes) section. I was thinking we might be able to combine the formats into one universal format for the American and Canadian versions since they air the least amount of episodes per week.

I looked at a variety of other reality show articles and found that Survivor: Borneo is currently a Good Article and so I thought we could use the format for Survivor articles but with a few tweaks. I know this was once proposed back in Big Brother 16 (U.S.) but I think this could work. I made an example at my sandbox to take a look.

The key is to summarize an episode with just the important details (entries/re-entries, who's nominated, who wins a competition, punishments, evictions) and leave out what could be considered "fluff" or excessive details (alliances, fights that don't result in Big Brother/production interference, etc.) to make the section easy to read and align it more with WP:TVE and WP:TV. I tried to add a description at the top for the "Timeline" column so readers unfamiliar with Big Brother would know what the column was for and what terms like "Day 1" meant. If anyone has any suggestions on this idea to make it better please let me know. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 04:46, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

A similar version of this in use exists at List of Big Brother 17 (U.S.) episodes however I do like your version better. I have no problem with using your setup. It better organizes the summary section. TheDoctorWho (talk) 05:20, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

We should also include medical incidents where houseguests leave the house temporarily or permanently to recover. An example is Omarosa's asthma attack during the Celebrity Edition of Bowlerina, in which she had to be hospitalized and was able to recover before the Nomination Ceremony. OfficerAPC (talk) 15:10, 12 February 2018 (UTC)

Metta's Eviction Vote

Did Metta vote to evict Chuck or James? People are saying there was a misunderstanding, but I thought he clearly said, "I vote for Chuck." Which way does the vote count? Jayab314 (talk) 16:25, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

The vote count should still state that he voted Chuck to go home, as Julie read the vote as 7-1 to the houseguests. VietPride10 (talk) 17:06, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

He voted the wrong way cause he's an idiot but it still counts. Spanneraol (talk) 17:07, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Would it be logical to mention in parentheses or a note that Metta meant to vote for Chuck to stay while still keeping the official vote? Jayab314 (talk) 21:01, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

I don't think there's a point to that. It doesn't change the game and trying to find sources for it to justify it would be a battle since a lot of "sources" are very opinionated people. I say leave it as is. The chart is meant to show who voted for who, not what they meant. RiceKid (talk) 21:20, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Agreed. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 15:45, 12 February 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 February 2018

Add Ariadna to the group of veto players under episode 3 2601:246:8200:3FF:3410:4E22:4052:51F9 (talk) 22:55, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

 Done By another user TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:09, 12 February 2018 (UTC)

Voting History

Does note 4 on the table seem necessary? It doesn't really seem to help explain anything on the table??? TheDoctorWho (talk) 14:39, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

Note 4 can be covered within the Episodes section as it discusses yesterday's live eviction episode. OfficerAPC (talk) 14:59, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

Right, and it already is covered there. To me the notes section should be to help aide in understanding the voting history table and note 4 doesn't do that. TheDoctorWho (talk) 15:05, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

Also, Notes 2 and 3 should be merged together as they discuss the same matter involving a surprise twist. OfficerAPC (talk) 16:31, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 13 February 2018

Keshia was evicted on Day 14 2A02:C7D:8AA4:5600:1155:6B85:C256:76D8 (talk) 15:54, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Chuck was evicted on Day 10 so Saturday was Day 11, Sunday was Day 12 and Yesterday his eviction day was Day 13. If you can provide enough reliable sources that support the dates are wrong it will be discussed. TheDoctorWho (talk) 16:16, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

Have Nots / Slop Only Diet

Julie said that the first three HouseGuests to drop would be on a slop only diet. Normally we make a section just for Have Nots however it could just be this one week and she didn't use the term Have Nots so how should we go about this??? TheDoctorWho (talk) 03:04, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

We should mention that within the summary table for the appropriate week. OfficerAPC (talk) 03:20, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

That brings me to the second issue I was going to mention later on. The Head of Household comps up to this point have occurred during the week that the powers are used in. However the Head of Household comp for week 3 is occurring in week 2. So writing it how we have been up to this point the winner should be listed in that section of the table in week 2 for episode 7 but we won't see the winner in broadcast until week 3. TheDoctorWho (talk) 03:28, 17 February 2018 (UTC)

Big Brother: Over The Top

There seems to be an ongoing issue here since the article has been created about whether or not to mention BBOTT in the lead. The sentence that's been here consistently and keeps getting reverted to reads: and is the second U.S. Big Brother season to air outside the usual summer television season, the first being Big Brother 9 in 2008. the version that I just reverted from reads: and is the third U.S. Big Brother season to air outside the usual summer television season, the others being Big Brother 9 in 2008 and the CBS All Access exclusive Big Brother: Over The Top in 2017. but other versions have existed such as: and is the second U.S. Big Brother season (not counting its 2016 CBS All Access spin-off) to air outside the usual summer television season, the first being Big Brother 9 in 2008. My view on this is that BBOTT should NOT be mentioned because it was not broadcast on television but I figure it should be discussed. ​ TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:02, 18 February 2018 (UTC)

I agree. Spanneraol (talk) 02:29, 18 February 2018 (UTC)

Airing on television and being streaming only is two different things so OTT shouldn't be mentioned alongside BB9. OTT didn't play into CBS' ratings unlike BB9 and CBB are. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 23:14, 18 February 2018 (UTC)

When we say "air", we mean the season was available on television, which wasn't the case for Big Brother: Over the Top in 2016 as it was only available on CBS All Access. Therefore, BBOTT should NOT be mentioned as a season outside of the annual summer series on television. OfficerAPC (talk) 00:16, 19 February 2018 (UTC)

Alright thanks, just making sure most of us were on the same page. TheDoctorWho (talk) 01:34, 19 February 2018 (UTC)

The Finale

Julie announced that there would be a double eviction on Friday, leaving five people left during Sunday's finale. Exactly how will the finale play out amongst the remaining HouseGuests if there is five left? Letramsihtam (talk) 02:02, 22 February 2018 (UTC)

We don't know yet. Spanneraol (talk) 02:16, 22 February 2018 (UTC)

There will be an eviction after the first HoH and PoV competitions. The final HoH competition will then take place with the winner selecting from the final 4 who they want to take to the final 2. The other 2 HouseGuests will then be evicted. MSalmon (talk) 22:35, 24 February 2018 (UTC)

Runner-Up / AFP

Have a winner or runner-up also ever won America's Favorite HouseGuest? If not is this info worth including? TheDoctorWho (talk) 03:19, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

That has never happened until now, perhaps we should discuss what color to use for this unusual scenario. OfficerAPC (talk) 03:46, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

Juror Order

Ari and Mark were evicted at the same time so there appears to be an edit war over the order to list them in. The two options are either listing them alphabetically (Ariadna (first) and then Mark (second)) or as the juror number Julie announced them as: Ariadna as #8 and Mark as #9 (making Mark (first) and then Ariadna (second)). Thoughts? TheDoctorWho (talk) 03:44, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

I'm thinking Option 2 since juror numbers are always based on when each juror was evicted from the Big Brother house. The reason behind the juror order between the two was most likely because Ariadna left the house before Mark. OfficerAPC (talk) 03:49, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

Agreed. If there wasn't an official order announced I'd say alphabetically but since there is an order I'd say follow the order. We followed order EVERYWHERE else in the article why not here? TheDoctorWho (talk) 03:51, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

Just because Julie announced them does not make it true. Marissa even said in her speech Mark, then Ariadna. Looking back I want to make sure Ariadna was first because they were truly evicted at same time. In Big Brother Canada triple eviction they were listed alphabetically. TheDoctorWho (talk) 03:51, 26 February 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bsems (talk • contribs)

It doesn't matter what you want, it should be what's in best interest for the article. Which up to this point has been the OFFICIAL order. Up to this point everyone has been reverting to the official order. You're the only one who is going against that. Please don't revert against that again unless consensus is found otherwise here. TheDoctorWho (talk) 13:50, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

Julie Chen confirmed the order on "The Talk" today as she brought them out in the order they finished. it was Marissa, Ross, Ari, and then Mark Wanheda (talk) 21:52, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

We are going by the order that they were on the show itself.. not The Talk.. They all voted in order and had numbers by their names. That's the official word on it.. Mark was the last juror. Spanneraol (talk) 22:08, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

Ok but I thought that chart was for the order they were evicted in.. not their jury numbers.. because technically Marissa evicted mark first regardless of what numbers they were Wanheda (talk) 22:34, 26 February 2018 (UTC)

True, if you watch the final episode very closely; however, Mark exited the house after Ariadna, which I suspect to be why those two were 9th and 8th jurors, respectively. OfficerAPC (talk) 00:27, 27 February 2018 (UTC)

Did we ever reach a consensus on this first-time situation? OfficerAPC (talk) 02:09, 1 March 2018 (UTC)

I believe it has come to list them as Julie announced them the night of. TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:25, 1 March 2018 (UTC)

At the moment, Ariadna is listed as the 9th juror while Mark is listed as the 8th. OfficerAPC (talk) 02:28, 1 March 2018 (UTC)

They tied for third. They are both third place. They should be listed in alphabetical order. @TheDoctorWho: @OfficerAPC: @Wanheda: @Spanneraol: ~ Totaldramaman ^{(talk · contribs)} 19:27, 30 March 2018 (UTC)

Consensus ruled an official order exists (namely, Juror Numbers), so it's best to follow that, listing Mark and Ariadna as 3rd and 4th, respectively. OfficerAPC (talk) 19:50, 30 March 2018 (UTC)

Big Brother endgame template

Per the template documentation located at Template:Big Brother endgame the housemate part reads:

• hmxx: This is where a housemate's name should be written. Names are not automatically linked to anything, so these need to be created manually.

and I realized that going all the way back to BB1 that none of the templates have been linked. Is this something we should do? I'm willing to go back and link them all but I figure it's better to discuss first. TheDoctorWho (talk) 02:39, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

Another thing to discuss is adding TV series to the individual Big Brother # (U.S.) articles, citing WP:NCTV. OfficerAPC (talk) 15:47, 10 March 2018 (UTC)

To answer your questions:

• For the Template:Big Brother endgame that part in question means if you want to link the contestant's name with their entry in List of Celebrity Big Brother houseguests (U.S.) or their own dedicated article you need to do this manually. Whereas the opposite is true for Template:Big Brother housemates. When the article is using the Big Brother housemates if you take | hmpage = and put | hmpage = List of Celebrity Big Brother houseguests (U.S.) then for example Brandi's name would have been linked to List of Celebrity Big Brother houseguests (U.S.)#Brandi in the template. The only way for the linking to work correctly in Template:Big Brother housemates is the header on List of Celebrity Big Brother houseguests (U.S.) for example must only have the first name of the HouseGuest.
• Adding TV series will not work as it will lead to confusion since North American TV uses the term seasons not series. The policy your looking for is WP:TVSEASON which is actually a more project wide discussion than just a U.S. related discussion. So far Big Brother Canada articles seem to be following the naming convention established in WP:TVSEASON. So according to WP:TVSEASON to bring the entire Big Brother franchise into compliance here are some examples of the work needed:

Current title	Title following WP:TVSEASON
Big Brother 19 (U.S.)	Big Brother (U.S. season 19)
Celebrity Big Brother 20 (UK)	Celebrity Big Brother (UK series 20)
Big Brother Africa 5	Big Brother Africa (season 5)
Big Brother Brasil 9	Big Brother Brasil (season 9)
Big Brother Canada (season 5)	No change
Big Brother 2012 (Finland)	Big Brother (Finland season 8)
Big Brother México 2015 (Season 4)	Big Brother México (season 5)
Bigg Boss 10	Bigg Boss (India season 10)
HaAh HaGadol 5	HaAh HaGadol (season 5)
Veliki brat 2009	Veliki brat (season 3)

So for changing the names this actually would be a discussion that would need to occur on the talk page of either WP:BIGBRO or Big Brother (franchise) then a notice on articles like Big Brother (U.S. TV series) pointing to the discussion. ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 18:16, 10 March 2018 (UTC)

Naming of various Big Brother articles

Hi! I started a discussion over at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Big Brother about aligning all the various versions and seasons of Big Brother (franchise) with the guidelines of Wikipedia:Naming conventions (television). I created a table showing all the different various naming conventions currently in use and recommended article names based on my understanding of WP:NCTV. I'm posting this notice to all applicable areas for a broad discussion. Thank You! ♪♫Alucard 16♫♪ 20:24, 10 March 2018 (UTC)