Talk:BDC Aero Industrie

This article

From the recent article history it looks like an editor representing the company requested that this article about one of the company's products be moved to the name of the company and then a small amount of information about the company was added. This has created a number of problems:

1. It confuses the company and its products, for instance we now have a company that that has specifications for its wingspan and such. The article is now a confused mess of little value or comprehension to any reader.
2. In the editing, all references showing notability were removed, leaving the resulting article subject to being deleted as non-notable.

So I will sort this all out as follows:

1. Turn the article about the company into a properly formatted article about the company, listing its products.
2. Reinstate the article about the aircraft type as an article about the aircraft type.
3. Warn the editor about his user name and COI. I see that the editor in question has already been blocked.

- Ahunt (talk) 22:57, 28 September 2015 (UTC)

Okay I have fixed all of this. Please do not move the article again without discussion first. - Ahunt (talk) 23:53, 28 September 2015 (UTC)

I will correct the references at TC so you stop to write non sense, and BDC Aero Industrie we produce aircraft not just fixed wings we do many other project and aircraft which we do not disclose at the moment, this is the right definition as was suggested by Wikipedia.BAI73 (talk) 19:50, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

Well right now we can only verify that BDC is producing or developing fixed wing aircraft. We can't account for secret projects or future projects, see WP:NOTCRYSTALBALL. When you announce production of a non-fixed wing aircraft, such as a helicopter, airship or balloon then we can update this. The beauty of Wikipedia articles is that they are quickly changed. - Ahunt (talk) 20:02, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

Edit requests

For BDC AERO INDUSTRIE INC.

Correction #1 Under the title BDC Aero Industrie Inc. is a Canadian aircraft manufacturer based in Lachute, Quebec founded in 2008. The company specializes in the production of aircraft ready-to-fly under the following categories: For Canada Advanced Ultralight Aircraft and Limited Class with Special Certificate of Airworthiness For USA light-sport aircraft category references are from Government of Canada and transport Canada

correction #2 Products The company's sole design is the Puma Advanced Ultralight, Puma Sport, Puma LSA, all single engine References are on the website, Transport Canada,

Let me know if you need anything else I will be glad to contribute. BAI73 (talk) 01:08, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Regarding correction #1, those categories are already mentioned in the article, right in the lede paragraph.

Regarding correction #2, those are all category variants of one aircraft design, we don't list marketing names here, just links to the aircraft type article. Both this and the type article indicate which categories it is in. - Ahunt (talk) 01:24, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Regarding correction #2 you are totally wrong, please go to the pages of Moneey Aircraft you have there all the variants with specific mods or changesBAI73 (talk) 01:35, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

As explained previously BDC Aero Puma does not exist the aircraft models are: Puma, Puma Sport, Puma LSA The Puma is Advanced Ultralight for Canadian market only, is lighter than all the other Pumas and uses 6061 T6 Aluminum everywhere, and uses light landing gear system. The Puma Sport is a heavier aircraft with stronger wing spar, heavier control surfaces, different wheels, different control system, and uses 2024 T3 aluminum and is the only one that can be equipped with constant speed propeller. The Puma LSA is a heavier aircraft with stronger spar and uses 2024 T3 aluminum and it can only have a fixed pitch propeller As you said these are variant but different models which in Wikipedia is mentioned on every aircraft. BAI73 (talk) 01:52, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

What is a "Moneey Aircraft"? I am not sure what you are talking about there.

As I have now explained several times we name aircraft type articles by "manufacturer-designation-name". This is the Puma built by BDC Aero, so the aircraft is called a BDC Aero Puma. You will notice Transport Canada uses the same system. It is all explained at Wikipedia:Naming conventions (aircraft). You can note that variants of the same basic aircraft type are normally listed on the same page as variants.

We can list these all as variants, but I need proper refs that actually show the differences between the various versions. Where does it say all that? - Ahunt (talk) 02:05, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

I miss spelled, is Mooney, the references for all the Puma type will be posted on the website as well I will do correction with Transport Canada. BAI73 (talk) 02:10, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Okay then I don't understand your point. The Mooney M20 with all its many dozen variants and sub-models is all one type and one article, so is the Puma. - Ahunt (talk) 02:14, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Sure if you can list the different variants on the company web page then I can add them all with descriptions of how they are different. Just leave a link here when it is up. - Ahunt (talk) 02:15, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

There also a mistake on your statement, The company specializes in the manufacture of ultralight aircraft in the form of kits for amateur construction and ready-to-fly aircraft for the Canadian advanced ultralight, limited and the American light-sport aircraft categories.[1][2][3] The correct statement is, The company specializes in the manufacture of aircrafts under the following categories: Advanced Ultralight, Limited CLass, and LSA. For your information BDC does not produce any KIT of any type they were previously offered but never made one and today BDC does only ready to fly aircraft, the day BDC will do that I will be pleased to let you know. In matter of fact we are working on a 5 seater turboprop under Limited Category so the question is what the company do? Aircraft right? Why it is so difficult for you to understand? With the statement you put you are misleading the readers. Look at this link: http://www.ic.gc.ca/app/ccc/srch/nvgt.do?lang=eng&prtl=1&sbPrtl=&estblmntNo=234567138751&profile=cmpltPrfl&profileId=1921&app=sold BAI73 (talk) 02:31, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Okay I have updated the article again using the ref you supplied, with info on the PX3000, plus the logo,etc. When you add some information on this design to your website we can add some more info on it here, and once we have a third party ref (like a news item) we can start a page on the aircraft type itself. - Ahunt (talk) 14:23, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

This statement have to change because is imprecise: you wrote "The company specializes in the manufacture of ultralight aircraft" it should be the company specializes in the manufacture of aircraft the way you wrote the statement looks like we produce ultralight only which we never produced, except in Italy. We never did Ultralight in Canada this is a false statement, we did Advanced Ultralight which is not the same, Ultralight don't have any approval only specs to fit in as per Transport Canada, but Advanced Ultralight have to follow the LAMAC standard and therefore have a certificate of conformity to be able to fly, as well as the performances characteristic are very different, you can reference to this: https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/civilaviation/publications/tp13301-tp13301-368.htm. Well get there, also I noticed many other errors on other aircraft manufacturer, we will get there one by one.BAI73 (talk) 15:25, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

On Wikipedia the term Ultralight aircraft includes Canadian Basic Ultralights, Advanced Ultralights and the European FAI microlights, as well as Australian, Indian and other similar categories. You can note that the legal definition in Canada says "“ultra-light aeroplane” means an advanced ultra-light aeroplane or a basic ultra-light aeroplane; (avion ultra-léger)", so your assertion that an advanced ultralight is not an ultralight is not correct. That said, since you are working on a larger aircraft I have changed the article to indicate fixed wing aircraft in the lede section. - Ahunt (talk) 15:48, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Another error the company produce aircraft not ultralight. Ultralight, advanced ultralight, lsa, limited, etc.. are categories we don't produce categories do you understand the difference? When I complete the five seater what are you going to write? producer of 5 seater limited?? it does not make sense, divide the product from legislation and regulation don't mix it. Example: what the company produce? Aircraft In which categories? Advanced Ultralight, Limited, Experimental, LSA, does it make sense to you?BAI73 (talk) 16:01, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

I have updated the infobox to read "products = Fixed wing aircraft" rather than list all the catagories there. The lede currently says "The company specializes in the manufacture of fixed wing aircraft in the form of ready-to-fly aircraft for the Canadian advanced ultralight, limited and the American light-sport aircraft categories. At one time they also offered kits for amateur construction." It doesn't say you produce "categories", it says you produce aircraft that fit into those categories. We normally indicate what categories of aircraft companies produce for reader clarity. Readers want to know what size of aircraft you produce, like airliners or hang gliders. Yes, it will get updated as the company range expands or contracts. That is the beauty of Wikipedia, articles are expanded and changed every day here as circumstances change. - Ahunt (talk) 16:11, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Correction in first flight the date in 2008 Canada the ones in Italy are not Puma they are Plutos which I cannot retrieve the number but I can do a search if you are interested.BAI73 (talk) 19:35, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

 Done - Ahunt (talk) 19:47, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

"<Manufacturer> <Aircraft>" is the preferred naming convention for aircraft articles. We have <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_DC-3> and <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_747>, for instance.

You can read the naming guideline located at <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Naming_conventions_(aircraft)>

Yours sincerely, Tim Boehde

BAI73 (talk) 19:51, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

Exactly the same thing I said from the start. - Ahunt (talk) 20:02, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

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