Talk:Adele of Meaux

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Untitled edit

Latest comment: 11 years ago2 comments2 people in discussion

Something is wrong here: This is not the daughter of Robert of Vermandois and this is not the first wife of Geoffrey I of Anjou, but his second. I suppose this is a mix-up of both wifes. Someone pls separate them! / Ola — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.247.27.221 (talk) 13:27, 31 October 2012 (UTC)Reply

I think you may be partially correct, but this article is about the daughter of Robert of Vermandois. There is fair degree of confusion between Adel and her mother, who does not have a page, but the key to the problem may be in Adele's date of death. Bearpatch (talk) 18:46, 31 October 2012 (UTC)Reply

Adele vs. Adelaide edit

Latest comment: 11 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

I fell into this same trap myself before realizing one woman could not be married to two men simultaneously and have two sets of children born during the same time period. Clearly even among better sources she’s been confused with her mother. First, Adele was born c. 950 and that agrees with the chronology of her parents’ marriage and is consistent with the birth of her brother Heribert. So it would be impossible for her to be married and have a daughter born in 956—at best she’d be six years old! Also, she cannot have married Lambert, Count of Chalon in c.970 and be having a son with Geoffrey I of Anjou the same year, not to mention later still supposedly having children with two husbands. Adele died in 974 so how was it she had another son Maurice after that? Some sources show her mother, Adelaide, marrying Geoffrey after her daughter’s death and being the mother of Maurice only. But again, it just shows more confusion between Adelaide and Adele. The most reasonable solution and the only one that makes sense chronologically is that Geoffrey married Adelaide, the widowed countess of Meux and her daughter Adele married Lambert, Count of Chalon. Adelaide and Geoffrey I of Anjou had their first child c. 956, their second in 970. Adele and Lambert had their first child c. 970 and two additional children before her death in 974. Any thoughts on a better scenario? Bearpatch (talk) 22:14, 12 November 2012 (UTC)Reply

Suggestion edit

Hi , I just returned to this article again, on a deeper level.

This is what I think is the problem:

Adele of Meaux' (c. 950–c. 974), (a.k.a. "Adele of Vermandois") was a French noblewoman. She was Countess consort of Chalon and later Countess consort of Anjou.

'#### she was rather born ~934, but I guess 950 is OK with Adelaide of Chalon. (Whose parentage should probably simply be "Unknown") ####

Adele was a daughter of Robert of Vermandois, Count of Meaux and Troyes, and Adelaide de Chalon.^[1] Adele died in 974.^[2]

'#### This Family chapter is definitely from the CV of Adelaide of Chalon ! ###

Family She married c. 970 Lambert, Count of Chalon († 22 February 978). Their children were:

Hugh I of Autun, Bishop of Auxerre and Count of Chalon. († 1039).^[3]
Mahaut of Autun, Dame de Donzy († bef. 1019).^[3]
Aelis of Chalon, who married c. 991 Guy I, Count of Macon.^[3]

Also Adele (935-974) is named as his wife in the article of Geoffrey I of Anjou , whose family I insert below:

Family He married Adele of Meaux (934–982), daughter of Robert of Vermandois and Adelais de Vergy. Their children were:

Ermengarde-Gerberga of Anjou (b. 956),^[4] married Conan I of Rennes.^[5] She secondly married William II of Angoulême.^[6]
Fulk III of Anjou (970-1040), he succeeded his father as Count of Anjou.^[7]
Geoffrey of Anjou (971-977), died young.^[8]

I only contribute in my own native language by principle, so please someone - fix this article / Ola

References

^ Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band III Teilband 1 (Marburg, Germany: Verlag von J. A. Stargardt, 1984), Tafel 49
^ Bernard S. Bachrach, Fulk Nerra the Neo-Roman Consul, 987-1040 (Berkeley & Los Angeles: University of California Press, 1993), p. 11
^ ^a ^b ^c Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band III Teilband 3 (Marburg, Germany: Verlag von J. A. Stargardt, 1985), Tafel 433
^ Cite error: The named reference FN9 was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
^ Cite error: The named reference ESII-75 was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
^ Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band III Teilband 4 (Verlag von J. A. Stargardt, Marburg, Germany. 1989), Tafel 817
^ Bernard S. Bachrach, Fulk Nerra the Neo-Roman Consul, 987-1040 (University of California Press, 1993), p. 11
^ Bernard S. Bachrach, Fulk Nerra the Neo-Roman Consul, 987-1040 (University of California Press, 1993), pp. 11-12

Genealogical Correction edit

Latest comment: 9 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Here is a possible solution to this problem.

Arnulf I of Flanders married c. 935, Adele (c. 915 - 960), daughter of Herbert II of Vermandois.

Geoffrey I of Anjou married c. 955, Adele (c. 935 - c. 990), daughter of Robert of Vermandois.

Lambert of Chalon married c. 970, Adele (c. 930 - c. 990), daughter of Lietaud II of Macon. (She was married previously c. 950, Gerhart of Metz).

Charles I of Lower Lorraine married c. 975, Adele (c. 935 - 990), daughter of Robert I of Vermandois. (She was married previously c. 955, Geoffrey I of Anjou).

ChuckRFord (talk) 02:23, 4 July 2014 (UTC)Reply

Add topic

[1] Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band III Teilband 1 (Marburg, Germany: Verlag von J. A. Stargardt, 1984), Tafel 49

[2] Bernard S. Bachrach, Fulk Nerra the Neo-Roman Consul, 987-1040 (Berkeley & Los Angeles: University of California Press, 1993), p. 11

[ESIII3-433-3] Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band III Teilband 3 (Marburg, Germany: Verlag von J. A. Stargardt, 1985), Tafel 433

[FN9-4] Cite error: The named reference FN9 was invoked but never defined (see the help page).

[ESII-75-5] Cite error: The named reference ESII-75 was invoked but never defined (see the help page).

[6] Detlev Schwennicke, Europäische Stammtafeln: Stammtafeln zur Geschichte der Europäischen Staaten, Neue Folge, Band III Teilband 4 (Verlag von J. A. Stargardt, Marburg, Germany. 1989), Tafel 817

[7] Bernard S. Bachrach, Fulk Nerra the Neo-Roman Consul, 987-1040 (University of California Press, 1993), p. 11

[8] Bernard S. Bachrach, Fulk Nerra the Neo-Roman Consul, 987-1040 (University of California Press, 1993), pp. 11-12

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