Talk:East Palestine, Ohio, train derailment

(Redirected from Talk:2023 Ohio train derailment)
Latest comment: 10 days ago by Sealpaii in topic Inconsistent Number of Derailed Cars

The section "Second Ohio derailment" should be removed due to lack of relevence. edit

The section discussion the second Ohio derailment should be removed. There have been six other rail accidents but those are not mentioned. Grinhelm (talk) 15:55, 23 March 2023 (UTC)Reply

Since there seems to be renewed media interest in train crashes (for whatever reason), should we consider spinning off to another article, "2023 Rail Accidents in the United States"? Kcmastrpc (talk) 16:18, 23 March 2023 (UTC)Reply
The Springfield train wreck is captured on the page List of rail accidents (2020–present). The page shows major rail accidents in 2023. Grinhelm (talk) 16:20, 23 March 2023 (UTC)Reply
Meh. It isn't very relevant, but RSs have mentioned the two accidents together so following that coverage is a reasonable default. VQuakr (talk) 16:44, 23 March 2023 (UTC)Reply
Maybe create 2023 United States freight derailments or a similar article to cover all of these derailments? InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 17:54, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply

Requested move 6 April 2023 edit

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. The principal result of the discussion was a consensus that the current title is more WP:RECOGNIZABLE than the proposed one. A weaker consensus also emerged that the proposed title is more WP:PRECISE than necessary. (non-admin closure) ModernDayTrilobite (talkcontribs) 15:27, 14 April 2023 (UTC)Reply


2023 Ohio train derailment2023 East Palestine train derailmentWP:PRECISE would justify that a more precise title would be better suited for the article, and the previous move discussion did not show substantial opposition to mentioning East Palestine. Data from Google Trends shows that East Palestine gained more searches (albeit marginally) than "Ohio train derailment", and Google searches for the incident provide more results for "East Palestine" train rather than "Ohio train derailment", by almost double the amount of queries. All in all, while the improvement is marginal from changing the title to include East Palestine, it conforms with our policies and general trends better. InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 17:53, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply

@InvadingInvader: the previous move discussion, [1] did show rough consensus against moving to "East Palestine" as too obscure. What has changed since then? Your Google trends search compared apples to oranges by only including "train derailment" in the Ohio string. Here is the corrected one, with the caveat that this is a pretty useless way of looking at things in general. VQuakr (talk) 18:07, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
When an event happens in a small town, people search for it at a much higher rate without including what actually happened. It is necessary in this case to omit "train derailment" from East Palestine, as people very well (in my data at least) did search for it. InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 18:11, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
ETA - you made a similar error on the Google searches; when corrected, "2023 Ohio train derailment" is clearly more common. Probably best to withdraw this move nom since it's solely predicated on errors. VQuakr (talk) 18:11, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
"2023 Ohio train derailment" has 18,000 results. Also think about why people searched for East Palestine in the first place; it was because of the train derailment. People would search for Ohio not only because of the train derailment but also Ohio University, Ohio facts and figures, the memes about Ohio which have recently appeared on TikTok... InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 18:15, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
Yup, which is roughly 10x as many hits as "2023 east palestine train derailment". The string has "train derailment" in it; arguments about TikTok are nonsensical. VQuakr (talk) 18:20, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
Claiming that arguments involving TikTok are nonsensical is inaccurate. Is it as important as everything else? No. However, should it be mentioned when it comes to what readers search and with attention to rational information disambiguating? Absolutely. InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 19:59, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
No, such arguments are completely, indefensibly, ridiculous. Equal-footing search terms exclude tiktok from both sets of search results equally, and show a ~~5x-10x balance of results in favor of the status quo title. Given that it is demonstrably incorrect or fallacious in every aspect, the most generous description of this nomination that can be given is "incompetent." VQuakr (talk) 20:33, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
How is popular culture and the thoughts of the youth ridiculous? We should be encyclopedic, but not completely exclusive to academia. We aren't anyways; if we are, we would not have articles on My Little Pony and Mario Kart. Moreover, Ohio's status as a meme has been covered by the press, see Yahoo Sports, HITC, and Dextero as examples. We aren't Citizendium. InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 21:39, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
It's a ridiculous argument because none of those links will show up in either search string. It's an obviously irrelevant distraction. VQuakr (talk) 22:41, 6 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
I agree with this. If I’m looking for the news on this, just searching for the town name would give me hits, but I’d have to further narrow it down if I were to use the state as a search term. BhamBoi (talk) 04:31, 8 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
Also note that national some news sources call it "East Palestine train derailment" BhamBoi (talk) 04:34, 8 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
  • Oppose. Proposed name is unrecognisable to many. In fact the current redirect from East Palestine should be changed, as the phrase East Palestine is at least ambiguous, a town with a population of less than 5000 can't compete as primary topic against the other meanings of Eastern Palestine. Andrewa (talk) 02:22, 14 April 2023 (UTC)Reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Supply Truck picture is blatant political speech, wildly unnecessary, and completely out of place edit

Seriously this is there for political reasons. It was slipped in with the subtlety of a baboon. Mferrari3 (talk) 04:23, 25 June 2023 (UTC)Reply

I agree. Considering MOS:PERTINENCE this image is unnecessary and distracting There's already another photo in that section anyways. If a better image can be found, this one should be replaced. Otherwise, we wouldn't be losing much by removing it either. In the alternative, if a gallery were added to this article, I would be in favour of putting this in the gallery and removing it from the main text instead of deleting it altogether. Combustible Vulpex (talk) 11:06, 11 December 2023 (UTC)Reply
The truck was delivering supplies to the village. To suggest it was irrelevant is ridiculous Trade (talk) 09:56, 7 March 2024 (UTC)Reply

Requested move 17 February 2024 edit

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved to East Palestine, Ohio, train derailment. Consensus to move, and consensus on the alternate proposed title. – robertsky (talk) 15:49, 26 February 2024 (UTC)Reply


2023 Ohio train derailmentEast Palestine train derailmentWP:COMMONNAME and the year does not need to be included as it could not be confused with any other disaster if the name of town is included. MountainDew20 (talk) 23:29, 17 February 2024 (UTC)Reply

  • Support the proposed title is clearly more recognizable based on media coverage, and therefore more useful to our readers. I would not usually support this sort of move but this event has gotten an exceptional level of coverage, with almost all of it using "East Palestine" much more prominently than "Ohio". Elli (talk | contribs) 23:48, 17 February 2024 (UTC)Reply
  • Support. The media coverage has put more attention to East Palestine than Ohio train derailment. Furthermore, in a previous discussion that had a similar approach, it was mentioned there were other incidents like this in Ohio. For me at least, I think the change would help make the disaster title be more recognizable.
174.44.191.134 (talk) 04:11, 18 February 2024 (UTC)Reply
Per WP:CONCISE and WP:CONSISTENT, almost half of these indeed lack the date identifier, so I don't see why it's really necessary. StonyBrook babble 23:06, 25 February 2024 (UTC)Reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Inconsistent Number of Derailed Cars edit

In the first paragraph is states that 38 cars derailed, but under the derailment section, it says 51 cars derailed. Which is it actually? Or is it that 51 cars became separated from the freight train and only 38 of those 51 actually derailed? Sealpaii (talk) 17:18, 17 March 2024 (UTC)Reply