Talk:2016 Kalamazoo shootings

Kalamazoo shooting death count

I don't want to get into an edit war on the article itself... I know that many media organizations have reported the death toll as seven, but at a 7:00am press conference, Kalamazoo Public Safety clarified that six are dead. A 14-year-old girl who was hospitalized was falsely reported to have died, but is actually alive. See Kalamazoo Public Safety posting on Facebook clarifying the death count: https://www.facebook.com/KalamazooPublicSafety/posts/710564742419230 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chidoelrey (talk • contribs) 12:37, 21 February 2016 (UTC)

@Chidoelrey: Thanks for clarification, thought you missed hospitalized girl. Feel free to update article with new-information sources. Spirit Ethanol (talk) 12:40, 21 February 2016 (UTC)

Serial killer?

Would this person be described as a serial killer given the number of victims? - Knowledgekid87 (talk) 22:17, 21 February 2016 (UTC)

No. He's a spree killer. 108.201.223.175 (talk) 04:03, 22 February 2016 (UTC)

No way. This event definitely has the hallmarks of a shooting spree. Parsley Man (talk) 22:34, 22 February 2016 (UTC)

Hoax suit

If someone eventually writes critical articles about the shoddy journalism that allowed this story to be printed in the first place, perhaps a mention of this might be appropriate in the article's about the news organisations involved. It has no place here. It has 0 zilch nada to do with this story. People pull crap like this to get attention. Although this involves a troll in general, not a troll on Wikipedia, our essay DENY still applies. John from Idegon (talk) 05:06, 18 March 2016 (UTC)

Uhhhhh... I don't see how "shoddy" the journalism was in this case. Everyone was fooled by the lawsuit at first, hence the initial reports. Then everyone owned up once the hoax was revealed. Parsley Man (talk) 05:12, 18 March 2016 (UTC)

You are entitled to your opinion on the journalism. However there is still nothing that connects this to the crime. Tangentally, it is connected to the person in custody. He is not the subject of the article. And the ethical issue of repeating a blip story here where it may be enshrined forever, giving the troll that did it exactly what he wants, definitely applies. John from Idegon (talk) 05:17, 18 March 2016 (UTC)

Really, I would like to know how the journalism was "shoddy". Also, I have a feeling that topic's notability may come up in the future. We don't know if the person who did this was really a troll or had some other ulterior motive, since we don't even have the person's identity yet. Parsley Man (talk) 05:19, 18 March 2016 (UTC)

IMO, much journalism today is driven by a rush to break news driven by the ridiculously saturated news delivery market. Everybody needs to be first, so they do just what you are doing here. Get it in there NOW. WP:Wikipedia has no deadline. When the story becomes clearer, if a solid connection can be made to the crime, I may not object to something. As of now it is tangential and trivial. If I were to speculate, I'd guess this crap has more to do with Über than the crime. John from Idegon (talk) 05:32, 18 March 2016 (UTC)

I see. Okay, that is agreeable. Parsley Man (talk) 05:36, 18 March 2016 (UTC)

Uber driver

Was there a special reason to address this man as, "a 45-year-old Uber driver, Jason Brian Dalton..."? I'm not an Uber driver but why identify him as that in the summary? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jtpaladin (talk • contribs) 00:52 22 May 2016 (UTC)

@Jtpaladin: The alleged suspect took fares between each of the three separate incidents in this spree killing and again between the last event and his apprehension. He is claiming the Uber app on his phone told him to do it. I'd say that his being an Uber driver is quite central to this story and certainly should be in the lede. Did you read the article? John from Idegon (talk) 16:46, 22 May 2016 (UTC) resigned John from Idegon (talk) 23:56, 22 May 2016 (UTC)

Brian Dalton redirect page

The Brian Dalton article used to redirect to this page. This is inappropriate because there is more than one Brian Dalton. I have changed the redirect page to a disambiguation page. If Dalton is convicted and his status changes from suspected to convicted, the disambig page will need to be edited too. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 15:00, 9 December 2016 (UTC)

Updated. Rmhermen (talk) 03:59, 11 January 2019 (UTC)

Requested move 6 November 2017

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Not moved.Clear consensus.The title Kalamazoo shootings may be tried at a new RM.(non-admin closure) Winged Blades ^Godric 16:06, 22 November 2017 (UTC)

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2016 Kalamazoo shootings → Kalamazoo County spree shootings – Multiple reasons:1) The title is ambiguous. There were multiple shootings in Kalamazoo in 2016, just like every year. It's a typical urban area. People get shot on a regular basis. 2)It's imprecise. Of the three crime scenes involved in this event, only one was in the city of Kalamazoo (I doubt it is in any way controversial that the prime topic for "Kalamazoo" is Kalamazoo, Michigan). 3)Another editor has expressed (through a reverted bold move to Kalamazoo shootings) that 2016 is unneeded as this is the only mass killing associated with this geographic area. That being said, and to avoid another discussion at a later time, I believe the sources have born out a contention I made above that the association with Uber is quite primary to this topic. A possible even better title might be Kalamazoo County Uber shootings or some variant of that. John from Idegon (talk) 16:26, 6 November 2017 (UTC) --Relisting. —MRD2014 ^{Talk • Edits • Help!} 01:35, 14 November 2017 (UTC)

• Comment - wouldn't 2016 Kalamazoo shooting spree be a better way to describe this than "spree shootings"? Suggest title implies the article will cover multiple independent spree shootings over many years in Kalamazoo, which in reality its only covering this one. -- Netoholic @ 12:21, 8 November 2017 (UTC) Added: putting vote as move to 2016 Kalamazoo shooting spree. Discussion hasn't convinced me that any other alternative is better. -- Netoholic @ 12:21, 13 November 2017 (UTC)
• Support move to 2016 Kalamazoo County shootings - The shootings took place all over Kalamazoo County, not just in Kalamazoo. Also, "shootings" is pretty concise enough compared to the more wordy "shooting spree" or "spree shooting". HastyBriar321 (talk) 04:17, 11 November 2017 (UTC)
  • "Spree shooting" is a specific type of mass killing, but sources have used both. Spree shooting is more concise as a shooting spree could be just kids shooting up stop signs. And leaving the title at shootings may be concise but lacks precision, as the area named in the title averages roughly 500 shootings per year. John from Idegon (talk) 15:44, 11 November 2017 (UTC)
    • You're insisting on renaming a whole lot of similar articles, then. That's gonna be quite a hassle. It's fine the way it is. HastyBriar321 (talk) 19:03, 11 November 2017 (UTC)
      • I'm not talking about any other article but this one. This isn't an RfC to set a naming convention for shootings articles, altho that would be a good idea. Not on point for this discussion, but what would we do if there were two notable shootings in Kalamazoo County in 2016? John from Idegon (talk) 01:53, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose. No problems with the current title. It's unambiguous in that there's no other article that could use that title. Other suggestions can probably all be redirects if people think them useful. Andrewa (talk) 17:09, 13 November 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose. No problems with the current title. And seems to be latest in a spree of anti-year RMs. Years are helpful with news items but particularly shootings. Sadly. In ictu oculi (talk) 08:02, 14 November 2017 (UTC)
• Oppose Current title is OK. ʍaɦʋɛօtʍ (talk) 16:53, 14 November 2017 (UTC)
• Move to Kalamazoo shootings. No need to mention "spree", that isn't a helpful addition. Dropping the year would be sensible though, per WP:CONCISE and WP:PRECISE.  — Amakuru (talk) 15:46, 21 November 2017 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.